Ok Jimmy! I’m looking through.
G1 - think about switching a Mech Infantry with a regular in Normandy. Since you should win with 1 Infantry, it could be a Mech instead and save you a mobile unit. If you know the ones in France will die - why not let regular Infantry take a beating instead?
***I think you’re right, this is a better idea and a reason to not put only inf in NormandyI don’t think any aircraft need to be used in Yugoslavia - they can both make it to naval battles and/or France. I use the Fighter from Hungary in SZ112, and the Tac from Poland in France. I openly defy the AA in France - it’s only a 1 in 6 chance, and it teams with Armor to give you an extra 4 for three rounds… which means you should keep an extra Armor and possibly an Artillery, by my math. That offer is too good for me to pass up, even with the threat of the Tac getting shot down. And with the land units you’re bringing, the Yugo battle is a two-rounder and should result in two lost German Infantry regardless.
***the aircraft in Yugo were really superfluous, they just wound up there because there were few other options for them to fly to. The one in Poland originally went to 112, I think you’re right and sending it there is wiser than Yugo in order to further safeguard the fleet. I’m not sold on a 1 in 6 chance of hitting a plane over Paris, I certainly wouldn’t count on that aircraft making it. I’d rather keep the aircraft from hitting Paris in order to guarantee their usage in G2 and G3.SZ112 just added the Fighter from Hungary, which gives you 12 pips or two hits, meaning a better chance to keep your Sub.
SZs 110 and 106 look good. It would be a bad idea for Britain to scramble.
That’s why I would consider hitting 91 with 2 subs and just air on 110. This would be in the hope that UK scrambles. If they do, the first 2 casualties will be BB hit and CA, after that it’s aircraft and someone might be unwise enough to save the BB over a ftr.Noncom - I would have used the Armor in Poland in Yugo - it can get back next round in time for Sealion.
This was my original intention, the armor went to WGerm because I knew no armor would survive on the French coast and leaving it in Wgerm means it can be shipped out G2. However you’re probably right, and Germany can still load up 3 inf 3 art for G2 naval threats.UK1 - I’d take out the Italian Destroyer/Transport combo with a Brit Destroyer/Fighter/Tac Bomber. Then you have the flexibility to park your fleet elsewhere.
that dd is needed to block for the British fleet off Gibraltar however.Even though I commented earlier on a different UK purchase, 9 Infantry is smart.
Noncoms look reasonable to me.
ITA1 - yes, I would also kill off the British as you did, but if I were the British I wouldn’t have given you the targets. And are you saving S France for G2? I’d let Italy have it, personally, and collect on it the first turn, and get closer to your NO.
Are you saying to forgo the blocker in sz94? Can the UK fleet survive without it? If so then I agree and UK should have moved that dd with the fleet. I forgot SFrance, it wasn’t crucial to my plans so I skipped it on my board.OK! It was cool to go through your moves and think about them. I also know it’s good to get some feedback.
Thx for the feedback, I;ll go back through and edit my moves so they are smoother, I’ll make sure to update the stats too, but it’ll prolly take a day.
Alpha 3 due next week
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Wow, you guys are pretty down. All valid points though… Play testing will make the final case I suppose.
That said, how would you make Alpha 3? What key changes would you make (specifically) if you were larry? Maybe this forum can come up with a Beta1 (if enough agree) and play test it?
Just a thought…
I like the Mongolians entering the war, but that’s about it. I’m not sure about the Paris NO yet. It might be good. I certainly wouldn’t have made Germany’s opening harder, or have made Sealion pointless.
I would have done more to split the attention of the US. Give Tobruk an AA gun and S. Italy a tac in addition to the strat bomber. Italy has a better fighting chance and the US would have to commit something to the Med/Africa.
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G4 invasion of london seems to be the way to go now imo. G3 is now alot harder. W8ing untill G4 will now also keep the russians (and not just the americans) out of the war. The upside is that the UK fleet in the med will not likely get back up to defend sea lion. With Japan i guess i J4 attack towards India will be my strat of choise in the first game. The Island NO is now kind of hard to get and the Indian AA will be less effective. The fleet of Italy will take a beating and maybe going for a neutral crush will be an option to get into the middle east.
I am not sure that the new set up and the new rules will reduce the axis win-ratio but i do feel that there are less routes for the axis to go and that is a bit boring. There might be strats that have not evolved yet but at first glance i am not overly exited.
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I am content that Sealion is now really difficult. I’ve no problem with that, but now I am not sure how they can win.
I’ll have to start a game here in the coming days.
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I really do like the new italian set-up, they are in a much stronger position then they where in A2. They destroyer and the tt will ofc be sunk but there is no way for the UK to mass up outside Gib and with german planes in s italy both the main fleets will be safe from attack on UK1.
It almost seems as the UK east med fleet might have to escape to the Indian Ocean to avoid getting sunk sooner or later. In UK1 i guess they can block but the blockers will get sunk I1 and then the AC will have to flee. They can also try and mass at Malta with some air cover but the Italians will be able to take them out there aswell. I guess the other option would be to bring the fleet from India and South Africa into the med to reinforce in UK2 but even then the Italians will have a nice shoot at them if they build a ship or a plane I1.
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The UK could ofc build an airbase in egypt and fly down figs from the brittish isles to protect their combined med/pacific fleet but then sealion will become alot easier.
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:?
To me it looks like Italy will lose 3/4 of their fleet instead of half in Alpha 2.
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well, there will be a trade of for the germans, they wont be able to send all thier air out to attack the uk fleet, 2 planes will have to fly south, if they fly from holland or w. germany they can hit normandy on their way, that leaves 8 planes to attack the 2 bb:s in the north sea.
i would:
use 1 fig from holland to hit normandy togheter with enough land troops to take out the fig with out loosing mine (the fig lands in s. italy)
rest of the land troops in range to hit paris
the tbmb from poland with my bb and ca to hit the 2 ca:s outside denmark
2 ss, 1 fig and 1 bmb to hit 111
2 ss, 3 fig and 2 tac to hit 110
one of the attacks on the bb:s will be 50/50 if they scramble, i would choose 111 as the bb there does not have a naval base.
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The fig in slovakia can be used against yogo and then also land in s. italy. The Paris attack will not be a good one but the Italians can clear it up in thier turn.
With 3 figs in S. Italy and the fig in normandy dead i cant see any attacks from the britts on any of the two major italian fleets.
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I am content that Sealion is now really difficult. I’ve no problem with that, but now I am not sure how they can win.
I’ll have to start a game here in the coming days.
Agreed, it was fairly difficult to pull off in Alpha 2… its almost as if one of the goals with Alpha 3 is to eliminate Sea Lion as a strategy all together. Between the new AA rules, the reduction in German air power, and the fact that Russia now gets to declare war when London falls, Sea Lion is all but off the table.
I do not want to knock this version too hard, as I have not gotten to play it yet, however on paper it certainly seems to take some options off the table for the Axis.
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Mongolia rule is interesting, but too complex and buggy (Japan can attack by sea or from SFE/Siberia). The simplest was include the mongolians as part of the non-agression treaty. It’s annoying how we cannot have a decent NAP rule a version after another, being so easy as it is forcing the breaker of the pact to pay some IPCs (15-20)
China still has not aa guns and the ACME wall is still there. Crappy
I still think that Axis keeps alpha2+ advantage. Anyway, let’s hope Mr. Harris send us a final version someday. I continue refuse playing non final versions :| Testing alphas continue being work of WOTC testers, not player’s work
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How do the Axis have the advantage in Alpha + 2? Sorry but I’m not seeing it.
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O M G ! MY ITALIAN STRATEGIC BOMBER MADE IT INTO THE SETUP!!!
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There also seem to be one less tac bomber in w germany even tho it is not marked as a change. If its not removed the 2 BB:s could both be good attacks even with scrambles. I cant see the point in removing this tbh, maybe just a missprint or might be to compensate for upgraded italian bomber.
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The US should be able to defend sea zones south and west of Iceland against all threats. That was a US/UK agreement in WWII that allowed the UK to concentrate East of Iceland.
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Other than one game, where i was the culprit with good reason (And the US was already in the war) why would anyone attack Iceland?
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Naval attacks in the SZ south and west of Iceland. The US took on that responsibility after a transport with US citizens was sunk by a German sub.
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Great discussion!
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What’s to deter Russia from attacking Japan? Nothing.
I don’t like the NO for US/UK in Paris. If the US and UK are in Paris after war has been going on for several turns, I concede as Germany. The NO is pointless.
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How do the Axis have the advantage in Alpha + 2? Sorry but I’m not seeing it.
Those 11 inf, big IC at Berlin plus 6 inf at Rome … and UK losing the option of sinking italian boats. But the first is the bigger, skyrocketing Germany to Leningrad
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After a closer review of the possibilities I’m more eager to playtest Alpha+.3.
Nevertheless I don’t understand the Mongolia rule. As I understand it the Russians can attack Japan R4 any time and still Japan cannot attack Amur from Korea\Manchuria? But when Russia pulls back, Japan could land with a Transport there and NCM everything up? Or they could attack from Siberia without provoking the Mogols? And what about the Planes? Are only the ones in Man\Kor not allowed to attack?
I’d really wish for a clarification from Krieghund and\or Larry.I also don’t understand why the Caucasus oil is now nothing worth for Italy, and I take the loss of the German Tac for a mistake.
IMO the Italian DD and TT in 96 is a free gift for the Brits since they can perfectly hide under their scramblers on Malta and now can even easily take out the Tobruk or Libya forces.
The AA rule is interesting even thou I don’t like that Sealion is no longer an option. This changes the G1 purchases since the Brits no longer need to be really afraid of a G2\G3 landing.
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