A lot of posters seemed stunned at this scenario, never scene it ever happen or even could happen. Now that I mulled it over last night and looked at the rules and so forth it is very obvious to me why no one has ever scene this scenario. Because the scenario makes no logical sense.
Italy DOW on Russia and moves in 2 tanks into Eastern Poland.
Russia is now at war with Italy and can DOW on Germany at the start of their next turn, turn 3.
Germany on Turn 3 does not DOW on Russia and just non combats into Eastern Poland.
Russia at the start of Turn 3 DOW on Germany and off we go.There is no logical reason why Russia would not DOW on Germany at the start of Turn 3, none.
Heck you could argue that it makes no logical sense that Germany did not DOW on Russia at the start of G3 since Italy brought Russia into the war and Russia WILL DOW on Germany on R3.
Hi PainState,
From my perspective, if I was planning on doing a G3 Barbarossa AND I wanted to drive towards the south, then yes, it makes sense to not DOW. My stack will be together except for the minimum required mobile units and maybe 1 AAA in Poland so Russia doesn’t attack Poland to get their NO for occupying an Axis territory. But E. Poland will be real strong because the German air will be there and maybe bombers will also be in range of a raid on the Moscow factory. Also, 5 IPCs is more income than I’d probably get as Germany on the 1st turn.
There are a few disadvantages of course. 1, Russian blockers can’t be attacked. 2, the Scandinavian units are behind. But for me that’s ok, I just use them to lay siege anyways. I never expect to get Moscow on turn 6 anymore. I assume that the UK/Anzac and that lone French fighter are going to get to Moscow.Â
Italy taking France I1
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Does allowing France to be taken by Italy (after a softening by Germany) make sense in the long run? Obviously, the 19 IPC boost is a huge deal for a meager Italian economy, but does it hamstring Germany too much at the beginning?
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I was forced to consider this situation on the fly during G1 of my last game. My Paris attack (pretty standard, no planes, all ground units in range) went horribly, and I found myself with 5 tanks left facing 5 Allied units. I considered breaking off the attack, and hitting Paris will everything the Italians could bring I1. I decided to continue with the Germans, and got lucky. My reasoning went something like this:
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The RAF could land in Paris on UK1 (3 planes in range) creating a difficult battle. If Italy went full force into Paris, Southern France most likely would have to be ignored.
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Italy would likely have only scarce forces remaining in Paris following the attack. France could counterattack Paris on F1 with 2 inf 1 art…if successful, they would activate 4 free infantry in Paris and collect income F1.
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Although this could give the Axis more IPC, it could also force the Germans to commit the Luftwaffe to Paris on G2, instead of using it to kill the Brit fleet in the Med (post-Taranto). I would have had 5 tanks to attack Paris, plus planes, against possibly 6-7 French 2’s. In a nutshell, I’d have 16 or 17 extra IPC’s, but nearly all my original western German and Italian ground forces would be dead, and the Med Brit navy would survive.
I only considered this for about 5 minutes during the game, and I’m sure there are some elements I haven’t even thought of. But, in the spur of the moment, I felt like I could lose control of the war by not finishing off the French G1.
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Italy could definetily use the economic boost, but it makes much more sense to give it to Germany. Germany is only given 30 ipc’s to start the game out, putting it virtually on par with the London Brits and far behind the Ruskies. Germany is also the most critical and important axis player (japan is a close second) as they start out right in the middle of the fight and face the full brunt of the British and Russians and often times the Americans like to go for Germany too.
Therefore the Germans need France, it is a crucial part of the axis strategy, if the Italians were to take it they would probably either spend it all on a fleet, which would not be able to raise a finger against the american/anglo fleet, or spend it on ground units to take the fight to russia but would still be playing the minor role on the eastern front.
Germany also makes more sense strategically in taking france because they can afford to spend 3 infantry a turn in Paris to build up the atlantic wall while fighting the russians in the east, where as usually the Italian player is spending all of their money trying to take Cairo/africa, which under the direction of an experienced british player, can be very hard to take.
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Thank you Stikato and Weezer for your thoughtful responses. I am currently in a game in which it was obvious that the Axis player (all 3 countries) has made a conscious effort to give France to Italy by retreating the Germans with 2 art, 4 tanks and leaving only the fighter in France. The axis player is one who typically comes up with strats that have never been played before and ideas that are way out of the box, but this time, for the life of me, cannot understand why.
Because of the lack of the 19 IPC bonus, a G3 (and really even a G4) Sealion is nearly impossible. I’m UK and with some careful planning (and even with building a bit in South Africa) can reduce a G4 Sealion chance to around 25% success (that is if Germany buys perfectly the next two rounds). And without a really viable Sealion threat, UK is just too strong early in Africa… so, even with the extra IPC to Italy, UK should be able to slow italy down enough to allow the US to get in the game.
Just wondering if there is something out there that I am missing. If my opponent is as good as he usually is, I’m sure I’ll see the light soon…
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Germany takes France or you can call the game on turn 1 because the germans need the extra cash otherwise they are screwed.
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Germany takes France or you can call the game on turn 1 because the germans need the extra cash otherwise they are screwed.
Once again an absolute on winning the game turn 1.
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