To TT on Tanks:
You’re under-rating the Sherman and buying into some of the anti-Sherman mythology that’s out there. The Sherman’s high profile could be a disadvantage, true, but it’s sloped armor was overall at least as good as the Cromwell’s unsloped armor. The Brits were very happy to get Shermans, as they were clearly better than anything else they had up to the Cromwell, which was about as good, maybe incrementally better. The worst Shermans were at least as good as (probably better than) the worst Panzer III’s & IV’s and the best ones were about as good as the best Panzer IV’s, (which actually made up the bulk of German armor by D-Day.) Shermans also performed pretty reasonably well in Korea against North Korean T-34’s. Yes the Shermans had trouble with the Panthers, but Panthers were relatively rare in the West (and it must be noted that the Panther is really a much heavier tank, more a “medium-heavy” than a “medium,” being significantly heavier than Panzer IV, T-34, Cromwell or Sherman)
The Panther is actually as heavy as the M26 Pershing and considerably heavier than the UK Comet, which was basically an up-gunned Cromwell with very little armor improvement.
So you could have a 4-tiered system:
But I really can’t conceive of needing more than 2 (much less more than 3) levels of tank
What’s more, the fact that the AA standard has made the Panther the de facto “standard” German tank means that to have a German “upgrade” it would have to be a little bigger (though not much bigger; we’re obviously not talking TWG bigger) and be a Tiger or Tiger II to make sense. Unless we went a little down in size and did a Panzer IV and made the wider versions of those old Panthers (which seem to be the new standard mold) the upgrades… But I would think that more people would be motivated to buy an “upgrade” than a “downgrade” product… (Pure marketing psychology, but such things are important.)
So, if you create a carefully calibrated “Tiger” upgrade tank (which perhaps you already have; like I said, I’m reserving judgment until they arrive and I can actually compare them.), “Pershing” upgrade Tank, JSII upgrade tank, Cromwell upgrade tank, that would probably be as much as I’d use, realistically.
Then again, maybe FMG is about to roll out these very models as part of their new product line…
Reloader:
Actually, as I recall, FMG said his ships, at least, were going to be slightly bigger to allow for more detail.
Coach:
I like your idea, though I’d have some concern about the issue of piece stability (i.e., not falling down)
Also, when it comes to special units, certain distinguishing features would stand out in certain cases: unique helmets/ longarms for UK and German Para’s, StG 44’s could be used for German SS, etc.
For me, a key thing for Para’s is those unique UK and German Para helmets
Thing is, I already can get much of this dynamic by using off-the-shelf HO’s for Para’s and alternate color AAA pieces for elites. Here’s my current set-up:
Germany:
Standard Infantry: MB AAA pieces in grey
Elite Infantry: (SS) AH AAA pieces in black
Para’s: Airfix German Para’s in blue-grey
US:
Standard Infantry: AAA Standard
Elite Infantry: (USMC) AAA US Marines in Dark Green
Para’s: Airfix US Para’s in Dark Green
UK
Standard Infantry: AAA Standard
Elite Infantry: (Royal Marines) AH UK Infantry in light tan
Para’s: ESCI UK Para’s in dark brown
Japan
Standard Infantry: AAA Standard
Elite Infantry (SNLF): Early AAP Japanese Infantry in red
Para’s: ESCI Japanese Infantry
USSR
Standard Infantry: AAA Standard
Elite Infantry: (Red Guards?): AAA Russian Infantry in bright red (from an AAP Pacific set, presumably originally designed to be “Chinese” infantry, but same sculpt as Russians)
Para’s: Airfix Russian Infantry
FMG’s pieces show more detail, but at the same size as current pieces.
Check out his pictures of a transport side-by-side.
Reloader:
Actually, much earlier on in the FMG pieces project thread, in direct response to my question to this effect, FMG said that his ships (or perhaps it was just his BB’s?) would be slightly bigger to show details. But I haven’t followed every post since then, so maybe he changed his mind? IDK
Italy
Superbattleship: BB1936 Class (basically a scaled-up, 16”-gun Littorio)
I haven’t checked my copy of Garzke and Dulin’s reference book on Axis battleships, but I don’t recall Italy ever having planned to build any 16" uprated version of the Littorio class. Is this a fictitious design or, if not, could you let me know where the information on this projected class comes from?
Remember that was before 1942 came out with “bigger” ships.
No, it’s not a fictitious design, though it’s obviously not one that they decided to go through with. In fact, the Sovietsky Soyuz design that the Soviets launched but never finished was based on this Italian Ansaldo design (though maybe not as closely as I’d originally thought; still if you compare the Sovietsky Soyuz and the Littorio side-by-side, the family resemblance is obvious). I got my info from Wayne Scarpaci’s recent book on Italian BB’s. So, like most of the “superbattleships” on my list, it’s not one that was built, but it’s one that could have been if the Italians had decided it was a priority (though they probably wouldn’t have been able to finish it on time in the real world.)
The French had likewise created three different alternative up-sized versions of the Richelieu class, my favorite being the version with 3 four-barrel 15" turrets. (I think 12 15" probably beats 8-9 16" unless possibly you’re going toe-to-toe with a real monster like a Yamato.) Wayne seems to think that they’d ultimately decided on a more conventional 9x16" though in his book on French BB’s.
for coaches idea with infantry, Samurai Swords had some units with unique bases taht worked out fine heres a link to a pic http://boardgamegeek.com/image/385022/samurai-swords
Well, TT:
They arrived (very quickly, I might add) and I really like them! I would have to say though, that I have to agree that they are a bit on the big side for mixing with standard AAA pieces. I also kinda wish you’d done Soviet units (with JSII’s!) in the first run instead of the Italians, so I could use them as upgrade heavies for the Soviets, seeing as the Italians didn’t have any heavy tanks. I’m thinking of using the Italian panthers as temporary stand-ins until something better presents itself… Maybe FMG will have a solution in its up-coming pieces line-up, though it seems to be taking forever to roll out…
The small arms on stands are an interesting concept and well-executed, except that I wish that all the standard rifles didn’t have the same SMLE profile. Given the level of detail, I’d think you could’ve done a creditable Kar98, M1 Garand and Mannlicher Carcano in the scale. But this is probably trifling, especially since I probably won’t use them anyway. I still say it’s better to stick with soldier-figures for the infantry.
Wow! I dug a couple of tanks from The War Game out of storage to compare and I found that the new TT pieces dwarf even them! TT’s Panther is about the size of TWG’s Tiger! TT’s Elephant is about the size of TWG’s Maus! (interesting double irony there, I guess…) Yeah, I have to say, TT: you’d best scale them down for AAA compatibility.
OMg this is really bad news…
Wow! I dug a couple of tanks from The War Game out of storage to compare and I found that the new TT pieces dwarf even them! TT’s Panther is about the size of TWG’s Tiger! TT’s Elephant is about the size of TWG’s Maus! (interesting double irony there, I guess…) Yeah, I have to say, TT: you’d best scale them down for AAA compatibility.
Yes I got my four sets of TT units yesterday and the tanks are quite large. For the most part not good for AA. Maybe can be used for BotB using ILs larger map. I made my first two bunkers out of the infantry pedestals. Cut the gun off the top and then drilled a small hole in the center of the portal that is located on the edge. Glued a portion of a gun in the drilled hole. Looks like one of those small bunkers on the Maginot line.
Any chance the TT tanks are big enough for Tide of Iron?
@Table:
I buy anything that has the same size as the regulare A&A pieces
I will buy anything that’s the same size as A&A, the same colours as A&A and also has Infantry pieces that resemble A&A.
OUCH! but I hear my infantry make nice pill boxes. :cry:
Don’t get me wrong. Your armor units are great! They’re just the wrong size. But your infantry is just not my cup of tea.
Someone on BoardGameGeek suggested to me that it is the WotC are the wrong size. :-D
Wow! I dug a couple of tanks from The War Game out of storage to compare and I found that the new TT pieces dwarf even them! TT’s Panther is about the size of TWG’s Tiger! TT’s Elephant is about the size of TWG’s Maus! (interesting double irony there, I guess…) Yeah, I have to say, TT: you’d best scale them down for AAA compatibility.
Yes I got my four sets of TT units yesterday and the tanks are quite large. For the most part not good for AA. Maybe can be used for BotB using ILs larger map. I made my first two bunkers out of the infantry pedestals. Cut the gun off the top and then drilled a small hole in the center of the portal that is located on the edge. Glued a portion of a gun in the drilled hole. Looks like one of those small bunkers on the Maginot line.
Not that I am happy your cutting my guns off but I kind of thank that is a cool move on making bunkers.
Hmm, I think I might have mixed them in with some old wider panthers. I don’t know if I noticed any difference vs previous wider panthers, but maybe I wasn’t looking close enough. The bottom line is that for me to use it, a tiger/JSII class tank MUST be at least noticeably bigger than the wider version of the panther to make sense and avoid heavy/medium tank confusion. That probably means creating a Pershing that is a little larger than scale. Same for a Cromwell if that’s what we’re stuck with for UK heavy tank, though the Cromwell was actually in the Sherman/Panzer IV/T-34 class. The UK should really use Cromwells instead of, or as an equivalent option for, Shermans in the medium class. The UK could then use Comets for a size-up heavy. (The Panther was actually heavier than the Sherman/Cromwell/Panzer IV/T-34 class of tanks; you could argue that a US Pershing and/or UK Comet was more an equivalent of a Panther than of a Tiger or JSII, but having 4 sizes is definitely too many; I’m not sure if I’d even really use more than 2 in my own house rules.)
No one else even had a tank in the heavy class that I know of.
I see the Tiger in a class by it’s self. There were other larger tanks but they never seemed to make production or much less see the battlefield.
This is where I am confused. All of you seem to have a great knowledge of WWII armor and talk like miniature players that want a game board with area and hex movement instead of pulling out a tape measure over Astroturf on a Ping-Pong table. So I tried to make a group of crossover armor and most of you think they are to big. When I put them on some of the A&A maps they work fine except in Europe. But in Europe nothing works because of the small areas and it is the focus of most of the battles. My new and more tank and infantry options do add to the problem but I think a new map is in order with an eyeglass view of Europe.
Sorry I have been away for a few days with family emergencies.
Also if you’re on BoardGameGeek, Table Tactics now has a microbadge. If you wanted one and are a short on GeekGold let me know and I will pass some along.
The problem is that we do not want to invest in a new line of miniatures that will not work with the exiting ones we have.
AAA size is what people are using, 1/285 or 1/300 work also with the AAA tanks. Since FMG is doing their line, a good sideline would to do , light and heavy armor, early war fighters, jets, early war battleships, heavy battleships, escort and heavy carriers.
Just ideas, but in the scale of AAA.
Yes we want big boards, but lets face it your tanks are out of scale with the other ground troop pieces. I just dont get the infantry sorry. :| I think a real oppertunity missed here. If you change what your doing in the future, I will happily buy your products.
Things needed:
anti-tank guns
German Rail Gun
Fixed artillery gun (like Singapore 1942 game)
Coastal defense guns
blockhouses
Rail stations
Kayusha rockets and German V2 rockets
These are good too!
Jack,
I hear the final nail in the coffin for the French pieces…
Methinks that they will be in A&A size after all? Tell us it is so!
