The Bismarck

[Lozza007]

Hey chaps,

<sigh>It seems I must be the Defender of the Faith when it comes to the Royal Navy  :|

Whilst I appreciate that Axis & Allies is only an abstract version of an historical war, if there are some folks keen on playing around with a German navy in AAE40 then they’re going to have to build it themselves, rather than say, invading Russia.  The reason they didn’t start the war with a large navy was because Germany chose to spend its money on planes and tanks.  Guns’n’butter trade off at its best  :-D

Size of Royal Navy in 1939 (1 year earlier):
The Royal Navy had 15 large battleships, 15 heavy cruisers, 46 light cruisers, 7 aircraft carriers, 181 destroyers and 59 submarines.

Size of German navy in 1940: 4 Battleships, 2 Pocket-Battleships, 12 cruisers (all types), 27 destroyers, and only a few dozen submarines of which less than 10 could actually sail march further than the North Sea.

As I said in a post in AAP40 forum, I have no problem with the UK “wasting” its money on replacing endless destroyers in German submarine raids, but regularly trashing the UK fleet as part of the standard German moves is just silly, not to mention impossible.

Cheers,

Lozza007</sigh>

[maverick_76]

I feel that for Germany a good starting navy should be 1 battleship, 1 cruiser, and 2 subs.

[idk_iam_swiss]

throw in two destroyers and a transport and you got a deal!

[calvinhobbesliker]

Then the Royal Navy should have 2 BB, 1-2 CC and 1 destroyer and 2 trans. They might have an AC

[maverick_76]

I almost forgot the obligatory transport.

But with that setup the UK should have:

2 battleships
3 cruisers
2 subs
2 transports
1 aircraft carrier with a plane

[maverick_76]

Actually strike one of the subs from the UK. There, that looks about right. Remember that Germany has the superior air force so even though UK is stacked navy-wise, a smart German player can still do heavy damage with good aircraft attacks.

[calvinhobbesliker]

@maverick_76:

I almost forgot the obligatory transport.

But with that setup the UK should have:

2 battleships
3 cruisers
2 subs
2 transports
1 aircraft carrier with a plane

I guess the lack of DD’s represents their poor ani-sub tach.
In the game, it’s going to be 1 BB, 1 CC, 2 trans, and after G1, there will be 1 trans left

[maverick_76]

Are you sure that will be the setup?

[calvinhobbesliker]

@maverick_76:

Are you sure that will be the setup?

No, but I’m guessing that based on previous games where the RN is weak and esily attacked before the UK gets a turn

[maverick_76]

True, we shall see soon won’t we?

[Lozza007]

Hey again,

I wouldn’t have said the UK’s ASW technology was poor in 1940.  They had sonar/asdic as well as basic radar.  The key thing is that there simply wasn’t enough escort ships to guard all the convoy routes, and air power wasn’t available in the mid-Atlantic.  The RN pretty much refused to let many of its destroyers be used as convoy escorts as they feared depleting the Home Fleet.

Again, I feel the best way to represent this in AAE40 is to compel the RN to remain in UK waters through threat of invasion etc, and then encourage the Germans to whittle away UK income through convoy attacks.  This will force the UK to invest in destroyers and other replacement units, rather than stacking up large and threatening France/Germany with invasion as early as 1940-41.

The UK can still have a powerful fleet but it will be a bit of a paper tiger if it’s only got 10-20 IPCs to spend every turn due to convoy losses.

Cheers,

Lozza007

[maverick_76]

I agree with you saying that they are a bit of a paper tiger, one you take convoys away you can pretty much kill them off without having to invade.