Bids

[tmartin]

What are typical bids for the OOB 1940 setup?

[AndrewAAGamer]

That depends on if you really want to be the Axis or not. Bids had gone as high as $60 to be the Axis but, the Yunnan Stack Bid has lowered that a bit. I would say low $40s to low $50s is a reasonable range.

[tmartin]

@AndrewAAGamer thanks… any recommendations what to do with a let’s say 45$ bid?

[AndrewAAGamer]

Yunnan Stack = $13

• Fighter Moscow
• Infantry Yunnan

Save 1/2 the British Navy + Taranto (I am a fan of Taranto) = $28

• Fighter Scotland
• SS SZ111 + SZ91 + SZ98

The above is minimum so that would be a $41 Bid. With $4 more an artillery in Africa.

[tmartin]

@AndrewAAGamer thanks ill have to try this out

[Arthur Bomber Harris]

@tmartin the crazy thing is that the game doesn’t feel that much different even with ~40PU bid. The Allies will more easily control the Atlantic, Med, and Africa. China will be more difficult to exterminate. Moscow will survive for a few more turns.

Otherwise the Axis can proceed as normal with India and Moscow eventually falling due to the overwhelming power of Axis air power.

The game changes dramatically at 60 PUs when China becomes so powerful they can drive Japan off of mainland Asia (or least credibly threaten that).

[Hansolo88]

@Arthur-Bomber-Harris said in Bids:

@tmartin the crazy thing is that the game doesn’t feel that much different even with ~40PU bid. The Allies will more easily control the Atlantic, Med, and Africa. China will be more difficult to exterminate. Moscow will survive for a few more turns.

Otherwise the Axis can proceed as normal with India and Moscow eventually falling due to the overwhelming power of Axis air power.

The game changes dramatically at 60 PUs when China becomes so powerful they can drive Japan off of mainland Asia (or least credibly threaten that).

I find the bid conversation quite fascinating.

Given what you say, wouldn’t that possibly be a sign the bids are being used in the wrong place? If controlling the Med/Africa doesn’t prevent the Axis key path to victory shouldn’t more of the bid be spent in maybe China/USSR instead?

[bakerbei]

@AndrewAAGamer Is low 40’s really reasonable? I admit that I only have real experience playing with my one friend, but I have long said that 14 IPC is the minimum I would take the allies for. Naturally, more is better, but I feel as if 40-60 is entirely too much. I have played maybe 25 games total, but they’ve almost entirely been against my one friend.

[barnee]

@bakerbei

Hi baker

I believe the bid depends on one’s level of experience. 25 games is a sweet amount. Wish I had a friend who would play that many :)

The league guys with the high bids have played hundreds of games against multiple players. Mostly against elite opponents such as themselves.

They have crunched out the best path(s) to Victory. If two people were to play for the first time, I’d suggest no bid. At an intermediate level, which is how I’d classify myself :) you may want a small bid.

Do you play online at all ? While not the same as in person, you can access a larger player pool and play more games that way.
Online vs in person would also affect the bid amount with in person being lower due to not being able to crunch your turn to what you hopefully believe to be optimal :)

Anyway, have fun gaming :)

[bakerbei]

@barnee Hi barnee! For some reason I feel honored, as if I’m in the presence of forum royalty!

Yeah, he and I work together, so we’ve had plenty of opportunities over the last 6 years we’ve known each other. :)

I mostly play in person, but with a few days in between each session, and we maybe get through 3 rounds in a session. Therefore, I have plenty of time to plan, mwahaha.

How would I play 1940 online? I’ve only ever done 1942 online and I found it a pale substitute for 1940 global.

[Arthur Bomber Harris]

@bakerbei by the time you have played the game a dozen or more times, you should pick Axis 100% of the time if the bid is in the 20s. With that type of money, the Allies can generally choose two of the following items for their money: protect one of the starting UK Atlantic fleets, accelerate control of the Med, accelerate conquest of Africa, or slightly slow down Axis progress in Russia or Asia.

None of those are so game changing that it prevents the Axis from a standard focus of overwhelming Moscow, drive into the Middle East oil fields, and conquest of India (usually 2 out of 3 means a win. No masterful gameplay is required if you have spent a bit of time understanding the standard openings (J1 DoW in the Pacific and a conservative G2 or G3 DoW plan in Europe).

By turn four, you should be able to look at the map and say this is going down the road for inevitable Axis victory unless you had bizarre dice in one of the few pivotal battles in the early turns (Paris, Yunnan, etc) that might happen 5-10% of games.

[barnee]

@bakerbei

You would use triplea https://www.axisandallies.org/forums/topic/17147/gargantua-s-k-i-s-s-triplea-instructions/30

I think some play with a "discord’ thing but I’m not familiar with how that works.

[AndrewAAGamer]

@bakerbei said in Bids:

@AndrewAAGamer Is low 40’s really reasonable? I admit that I only have real experience playing with my one friend, but I have long said that 14 IPC is the minimum I would take the allies for. Naturally, more is better, but I feel as if 40-60 is entirely too much. I have played maybe 25 games total, but they’ve almost entirely been against my one friend.

Being new and not having a lot of experience playing other people it is easy to not fully understand all the nuances of the game. It takes time to really get a handle on the Axis strategy. Once that happens you will see how difficult it is for the Allies to win; thus needing a major bid to make the game balanced.

A couple of years ago I played a gentleman face to face about 5 times over the course of the year. He had never lost as the Allies in his small play group before playing me even with a $0 Bid. Even giving him a $60 Bid I trounced him every game as he had just never seen anyone play the Axis the way I did.

When I first starting playing online here the highest bids were in the $30s and people were shocked that I was willing to give $60 and yet I consistently beat everyone until a new tactic was developed… the Yunnan Stack.

Based on the “Yunnan Stack” I feel $51 is now a good number. At least, that is what I would want to take the Allies. The days of high 50s or even $60 are gone now and that is what happens as people adjust strategies.

I would suggest pulling up 2-3 games from the top players and seeing how they play to speed up your learning curve.

Oh, and read my article if you have not already. :)

Good Luck and Have Fun! (Edit - corrected spelling errors)

[Faramir]

How reasonable would it be to bid for DOW turns instead of extra units? Like Japan cannot DOW until turn 3 and Germany cannot DOW until turn 2 or 3.

[AndrewAAGamer]

@Faramir said in Bids:

How reasonable would it be to bid for DOW turns instead of extra units? Like Japan cannot DOW until turn 3 and Germany cannot DOW until turn 2 or 3.

Hmmm, interesting idea.

Most people don’t DOW with Germany till G2 or G3 so that would not be much of a difference. However, not allowing Japan to DOW on J1, would certainly make a difference.

That is, BTW, the reason the Yunnan Stack is so effective. It stops Japan from doing a J1 DOW. The J1 DOW, I think developed by COW, is extremely powerful. It sets UK Pacific back tremendously and pretty much dooms India. Usually the only games I have seen where India is not taken by Japan until very late, or if ever, are all games where Japan did not DOW until J3.

However, I am not sure how much that would effect the Bid. If $13 stops the J1 DOW then removing the ability for Japan to do a J1 DOW would only drop the Bids to $38 which while certainly lower doesn’t accomplish what I think you are suggesting here which is a replacement of money with DOW delay turns.

[Arthur Bomber Harris]

@Faramir the game would be approximately balanced if Japan couldn’t DoW until j4, allowing India and Anzac to grab some islands and escape with their transports before the fighting begins. Still probably an advantage for the Axis but much closer.

[Faramir]

It would be interesting to test out. A set J3 and G3 would make it easier for the allies to make plans.