I just read this thread for the first time, and this looks good!
A suggestion. Use either 10-sided dice or 12-sided dice so as to give you greater flexibility in combat values.
I was thinking about your IPC dilemma. What if all nations started with a set IPC income. Then, as territories are captured, the defender losses the income for the territory, but the attacker gains no benefit. This works better for your time scale and “flexible unit pool” ideas. Basically it would work the same as convoy zones in AAP. The motivation is still there for the attacker as you would be harming your opponent’s ability to mobilize new forces against you.
I like this idea. With some tweaking, this could possibly be a good idea for the regular Axis and Allies games.
I think Israel needs to be included as a power in this game. After the US and Russia they are the greatest military power in the region.
I also think since there are already a lot of countries who would be unlikly allies, that this would make a great three sided-conflict game.
Keep Russia and Iraq as allies, then split the other alliances one side being Turkey-Iran and the other Egypt-Israel-Saudis. Or make it four sided with Israel on its own.
How about also including special WMD factories that allow players to build nuclear and chemical weapons. This part of the world is filled with crazy mass murderes.
I was considering adding railway lines to the map to facilitate strategic movement. What do you guys think of that?
Also, what are your opinions on technology development? I had some plans on the back burner for tech upgrades to the military units in addition to more general tech upgrades.
Railways or major road ways sounds great.
The tech developments should include chemical weapons and nukes. Israel and Russia have nukes and everyone is worried about Iran and other countries getting them. Chemical weapons were used in the Iran-Iraq War and the US was afraid saddam would use them in both gulf wars.
Chemical weapons should allow artillery and aircraft too keep enemy units from moving or attacking since moving through poison gas, even with the right equipment, is a very slow buisness and very dangerous.
Nukes should be able to be loaded into artillery, aircraft, subs and missles. They are expendable and cause a strategic bombing on steriods, they also damage some military units.
UAV?
Stealth aircraft?
Advanced SAM sites?
New oil reserves discovered: Foregin investores send you tons of money and weapons.
Been working more on this game. I finally ordered all the Table Tactics plastic pieces. These will form the backbone of the various units in the game. Together with the old A&A pieces I’ve got pretty much everything I need. The only things really missing are a modern bomber and a modern submarine. I think I’m going to have to order some miniature bombers and subs and paint them.
First the latest map:
-Egypt has now become its own seperate player nation with its own colour.
-A few regions added to Turkey to break up some of the larger regions there.
Other changes:
-Decided to ditch the Battleship unit.
-What I think I’d like to do now is to randomly assign two opposing teams at the beginning of the game. Each team would be composed of three nations. So you take the six player aid cards (one for each nation). You flip them over and randomly deal them out into two stacks of three. Those are the teams for the game. This will make the game really variable and change the entire nature of the gameplay each time. The trick with this approach is to make the game balanced enough so that there are no real killer teams that make the game unplayable. To this end each nation must be roughly the same in terms of power (both military and economic wise).
-I want to reduce the effectiveness of the cruise missiles. I think I’m going to limit their range to 4 spaces. and reduce their combat value to a max of 4 at range 1, 3 at range 2, 2 at range 3 and 1 at range 4.
More to come.
Those changes sound great.
I like the random teams idea.
I think Israel needs to be included as a power in this game. After the US and Russia they are the greatest military power in the region.
I agree.
I agree that Israel is a military powerhouse. However, including them as a playable nation presents a few challenges. Adding Israel would force a 7th player nation into the game and I don’t want to lose any of the nations I’ve got now (If I would squeeze one out it would be Russia I guess).
In addition, Israel is merely one region on the map. If they are to compete economically with the other nations Israel must have an IPC value of 30 or so! Either that or Israel starts with a huge military advantage.
For now Israel is going to have to remain a powerful neutral nation. It is the most valuable IPC region on the map and it includes a victory city (Tel Aviv). Accordingly Israel will have a very potent mic of military units should someone invade.
BTW: The armed forces of Turkey are no slouches either (2nd largest in NATO behind the USA). They are armed with modern equipment too.
Latest version of the map. It’s very near completion. IPC values are all assigned. The only thing I need to do now is flesh out the Victory cities.
I’ve tweaked the combat system a little. At the end of every round of combat both the attacker and the defender have the opportunity to attempt to retreat any or all of their units. These retreating units are moved to the “disengaged” portion of the battle board. If these units survive an entire round of combat in the disengaged area (disengaged units may not attack) they withdraw from battle and make a retreat move into an adjacent region. Basically a unit gives up its chance to make an attack roll in order to retreat. Submarines may “Submerge” and immediatly move to the Disengaged area after making an attack roll (getting them out of combat one turn quicker than most).
I was looking at some maps of the Middle East and there are roads, highways and railways threading all over the regions of the map. I think adding strategic highways or rail-lines directly onto the map is out. Instead, in order to keep it simple: if you want to use strategic movement pay 1 IPC to the bank and then you may move that unit up to 4 regions (limit of 4 units per turn). Perhaps a tech could improve this ability (advanced logistics or strategic deployment or something).
Getting close to printing this map out and playing a few games.
How much would the map cost to print? (In your opinion)
I would be very interested in purchasing a copy of the map.
How much would the map cost to print? (In your opinion)
I have printed and laminated maps for others games for around $20-$60 (as was mentioned the size makes a big difference).
The test map I printed was 25" x 27" and I found that some of the territories were a tad small (but larger than many of the standard A&A Pacific Islands). I’ve gathered all my pieces and soon I’ll host the results of a test game.
Wow cool can you post all the rules together. I would like to see Isreal as a power or just make optional. If need a eigth you could add afganistan or pakistan.
Map looks fantastic! Have you come up with the unit set-ups yet?
I like random sides as well, but reserve a historical option. How large is this map?
The map needs to be quite large. I’ve printed out a test map that measures 24" x 27" and it turned out to be too small. Some of the smaller areas can’t possibly fit all the units they need to. This is compounded by my design that has far more unit options than would normally be available in a standard A&A game. If you wanted a functional map, it would have to be in the 48" x 60" range.
Here’s some pics of my test game:
For my test game I made six playing card sized cards, one for each nation. I then randomly dealt them out into two piles and these were the two teams for the game. It ended up being Russia, Iraq and Iran versus Egypt, Turkey and Saudi Arabia.
The turn order was established as:
Egypt - Russia - Turkey - Iran - Saudi Arabia – Iraq
Each nation in turn had 250 IPC worth of units to deploy anywhere they want in their nation (or bordering sea zone). After that the game began starting with Egypt.
I resolved to play the game out until one nation was captured and then add up the victory point per side. For this purpose victory cities and oil resources counted as victory points.
The game devolved into two bitter struggles. Egypt and Saudi Arabia joined up and pushed into Iraq, while Russia and Iraq double teamed Turkey. In the end Baghdad fell before Ankara and after the points were added up the Egypt / Saudi / Turkey team just managed to eek out a victory.
Some things I learned about my design:
-Air power is potent but must not be squandered. In the initial barrage of attacks lots of fighters went down. After that the nations that maintained an air force had a huge advantage in the ground war.
-The loss rate far exceeds the build rate. The first battles were large, all-in affairs with tremendous casualties on both sides. After most of the units on the board were whittled down the battles devolved to much smaller scale clashes as each Nation only has 30 or so IPC’s to spend on reinforcements.
-Defending aircraft need to be able to participate in battles from at least one space away. After a nation would win a battle they would fly their aircraft back to friendly areas (as per normal A&A rules). However this left the newly conquered territory completely vulnerable to air attack by the enemy.
-Shooting first with everything ensures the attacker needs to have 2-1 odds to even up the score. With closely matched forces neither side can afford to launch an attack and a stalemate develops. I’m going to change the combat mechanics so that each unit type gets to fire in turn. In other words, during the ground combat segment of a battle defending artillery fire first and casualties are removed then attacking artillery unit’s fire. Next defending main battle tanks fire and casualties are removed, then attacking MBT’s. This way the defender still gets an advantage but not as much as before.
Overall, I’m very happy with how it played out. It was a much tighter design that I thought it would be.
The box in the lower left bottom is too dark of a green color to make it readable. Perhaps white and black bars?
I really like your map, awesome job, I do see what you mean by it needs to be larger, but that’s easy to do. It looks like a very fun game, excellent work.
Van you take pictures of the units and say what each one is please.
I notice something like an AA Half truck and some of the planes looked different than the A&A units. Also can you explain the points system.
Thanks
@The:
Van you take pictures of the units and say what each one is please. I notice something like an AA Half truck and some of the planes looked different than the A&A units.
All of the pieces come from the original Axis and Allies games and from Table Tactics.
http://www.tabletactics.com/
@The:
Also can you explain the points system.
Thanks
The points system for scoring? Each resource (oil well symbol) and victory city is worth 1 victory point. Capital cities are worth 2 victory points. Once the game ends (any one nations’ capital is captured and held for one complete turn) the side with the highest victory point total wins. Play continues if the victory points are even (sudden death!).
cool thanks. I like the placement rules
