@ManuC23 said in TGC vs ManuC23 - Classic, Restricted Attack, no bid:
I guess the M84 rule is used in these games?
Do you mean the economic victory for the Axis? If yes, then yes that is a standard victory condition.
PanzerStahl vs barnee EXP
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Hi barnee,
The OOB rules say that USA can declare War on any or all Axis Nations, if any Axis Nation unprovoked declares War on or attacks USA before round 3 (Early 1941).
Since an attack is made by Japan in Late 1940 (round 2) against United Kingdom and/or ANZAC - and not against the USA - a state of War exists only between UK/ANZAC and Japan - not USA.
The US National Guard is activated by USA in order to prepare for a state of War between Japan and USA - but USA do not yet know if Japan is going to attack USA… so USA cannot declare War until attacked or declared War upon - or until Early 1941 (round 3).
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@The-Captain Thanks Captain. That’s what I thought. I don’t know where simon got this because I can’t find it.
https://www.axisandallies.org/forums/topic/18412/global-2nd-edition-q-a-aag40-2/2964
following turn ? Maybe that’s my misunderstanding ? I see no benefit fot JPN otherwise.
Anyway, @Panzerstahl-Helm I need to completely redo USA 2. I’m not sure if I can tho. I’ve never tried it after posting a turn already. Should be able to I’d think. Idk.
I’ll give it a shot. We’ll sort it one way or another :)
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@Panzerstahl-Helm ok it’ll let me redo the turn in pbem. Be a while. I just got up to piss and checked for an answer.
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@barnee said in PanzerStahl vs barnee EXP:
Can’t edit posts here :)
The more I think about it, in EXP, Natl Gd activates after JPN DOW on UK/ANZAC but USA still can’t DOW Axis until of end of rd 3.
The dudes are just being deployed.
? :)
wtf why did I even ask lol
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@barnee
Good morning. I haven’t looked at the game map yet, but I guess in OOB the US can declare war after Japan DOW to UK/ANZAC. Thst is my understanding of the rules and I guess we used to play it in the normal G40 games.
Nevertheless, in case US cannot declare war to Japan yet, wouldn’t it be enough to adjust the income of the US (I think they receove a bonus when entering the war, so this amount could be reduced) instead of re-dping the whole turn?BR
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Hi @Panzerstahl-Helm yea Idk what’s up exactly. I asked Panther directly and haven’t heard back. I wish people would just answer the question instead of saying here’s the rules. I know where the rules are. That’s not what I’m asking lol
The Captain interprets it the way i do. USA is still Neutral after the JPN DOW Rd 2 on UK/ANZAC and must abide by All USA Neutral Rules including Movement Restrictions.
The National Guard does Deploy though.That’s how I see it and how I’m gonna play it :) It makes no sense otherwise. There is no benefit for JPN not to DOW USA if USA can DOW and Attack the same turn, Rd 2, that JPN does it’s UK DOW.
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@Panzerstahl-Helm what got me all confused is triplea doesn’t do it that way. I know triplea isn’t perfect, but theres no mention of it anywhere in the Game Notes to Player Enforce and it’s been out for 15 years lol
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@Panzerstahl-Helm OK after more discussion, triplea does it correctly and the latest save is legal.
EXP Game 1 Stahl UK 2.tsvgThe United States may not declare war on any Axis power unless an Axis power either declares war on it first
or captures London or any territory in North America, or Japan makes an unprovoked declaration of war against the UK or
ANZAC, after which it may declare war on any or all Axis powers on its following turn. -
@The-Captain so according to simon USA can Declare War against JPN Rd 2 in the above scenario. I don’t fully understand it other than it was Pacific map only specific maybe.
The above post is from the Global Political situation.
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Ciao!
As mentioned we used to play as we are proceeding in our game - if Japan declares war on UK/ANZAC, the US can declare war on Japan in the same round. Issue is the unclear definition of “turn” - is this meant to be round or turn in the meaning of each nations turn per round.
Anyway, I was expecting that the US will declare war and attack right on, as we used to play it in our gaming group.For future this scenarion can be more clearly defined in the wording. Furthermore I would suggest that in our scenario, the US cannot attack in the same round as Japan declared war on UK/ANZAC, but gets in war mode at the end of the round by collecting the bonus income for beeing at war and that the minor ICs are promoted to major IC. Just like TripleA does when Japan (or Germany or Italy) does not declare war on the US (or Japan in addition to UK/ANZAC) and the US enters the war in round 4. The US collects the bonus income at the end of round 3 + major IC.
Anyways, this little ambiguity should not affect our game. I was ‘prepared’ anyways and knew, that the US cann and very likely will also attack Japan right after the DOW to UK/ANZAC.
Game History
Round: 2 Purchase Units - Italians Italians buy 3 infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; Combat Move - Italians Trigger RailMovementAutoPlaceItalians: Italians has 1 Rail placed in Southern Italy Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Italians takes Syria from French EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode 1 cruiser, 1 destroyer and 1 transport moved from 93 Sea Zone to 95 Sea Zone 2 infantry moved from Northern Italy to 95 Sea Zone 1 cruiser, 1 destroyer, 2 infantry and 1 transport moved from 95 Sea Zone to 99 Sea Zone 2 infantry moved from 99 Sea Zone to Greece 2 armour and 2 infantry moved from Albania to Greece 2 fighters moved from Western Germany to Greece 1 bomber moved from Western Germany to 98 Sea Zone 1 armour, 2 artilleries, 4 infantry and 1 mech_infantry moved from Tobruk to Alexandria EDIT: 1 italian_para moved from Southern Italy to Syria EDIT: 2 Italian_LCVs, 2 artilleries and 2 infantry moved from Southern Italy to Syria Combat - Italians Battle in 98 Sea Zone Italians attack with 1 bomber British defend with 1 destroyer Italians roll dice for 1 bomber in 98 Sea Zone, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0,67 expected hits British roll dice for 1 destroyer in 98 Sea Zone, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits 1 bomber owned by the Italians lost in 98 Sea Zone 1 destroyer owned by the British lost in 98 Sea Zone British win with no units remaining. Battle score for attacker is -5 Casualties for Italians: 1 bomber Casualties for British: 1 destroyer Battle in Alexandria Italians attack with 1 armour, 2 artilleries, 4 infantry and 1 mech_infantry British defend with 1 infantry Italians roll dice for 1 armour, 2 artilleries, 4 infantry and 1 mech_infantry in Alexandria, round 2 : 1/8 hits, 2,33 expected hits British roll dice for 1 infantry in Alexandria, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits 1 infantry owned by the British lost in Alexandria Italians win, taking Alexandria from British with 1 armour, 2 artilleries, 4 infantry and 1 mech_infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3 Casualties for British: 1 infantry Battle in Greece Italians attack with 2 armour, 2 fighters and 4 infantry Neutral_Allies defend with 4 infantry Italians roll dice for 1 cruiser in Greece, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0,50 expected hits Italians roll dice for 2 armour, 2 fighters and 4 infantry in Greece, round 2 : 0/8 hits, 2,67 expected hits Neutral_Allies roll dice for 4 infantry in Greece, round 2 : 2/4 hits, 1,33 expected hits 2 infantry owned by the Italians lost in Greece 1 infantry owned by the Neutral_Allies lost in Greece Italians roll dice for 2 armour, 2 fighters and 2 infantry in Greece, round 3 : 2/6 hits, 2,33 expected hits Neutral_Allies roll dice for 3 infantry in Greece, round 3 : 1/3 hits, 1,00 expected hits 1 infantry owned by the Italians lost in Greece 2 infantry owned by the Neutral_Allies lost in Greece Italians roll dice for 2 armour, 2 fighters and 1 infantry in Greece, round 4 : 2/5 hits, 2,17 expected hits Neutral_Allies roll dice for 1 infantry in Greece, round 4 : 0/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits 1 infantry owned by the Neutral_Allies lost in Greece Italians win, taking Greece from Neutral_Allies with 2 armour, 2 fighters and 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3 Casualties for Italians: 3 infantry Casualties for Neutral_Allies: 4 infantry Non Combat Move - Italians Trigger RailMovementAutoPlaceRemoveItalians: has removed 1 Rail owned by Italians in Southern Italy 2 fighters moved from Greece to Southern Italy 2 infantry moved from Yugoslavia to Northern Italy 1 infantry moved from Northern Italy to Southern Italy Place Units - Italians 3 infantry placed in Southern Italy Turn Complete - Italians Italians collect 12 PUs; end with 12 PUs Trigger Italians AdvancedProduction: Italians met a national objective for an additional 3 PUs; end with 15 PUs Objective Italians 1 Control The Mediterranean: Italians met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 20 PUsCombat Hit Differential Summary :
Italians regular : -3,67 Neutral_Allies regular : 0,33 British regular : 0,33 -
@Panzerstahl-Helm Hi Sorry for all the confusion last night :)
Game History
Round: 2 Purchase Units - ANZAC Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Removing units owned by British from Malta: 2 uk_fighters and 1 uk_tactical_bomber EDIT: Adding units owned by British to Egypt: 2 uk_fighters and 1 uk_tactical_bomber EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode ANZAC buy 3 Fortifications, 1 fighter and 1 mech_infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; Combat Move - ANZAC 1 destroyer moved from 54 Sea Zone to 43 Sea Zone Combat - ANZAC Battle in 43 Sea Zone ANZAC attack with 1 destroyer Japanese defend with 1 submarine ANZAC roll dice for 1 destroyer in 43 Sea Zone, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits Japanese roll dice for 1 submarine in 43 Sea Zone, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0.17 expected hits ANZAC roll dice for 1 destroyer in 43 Sea Zone, round 3 : 1/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits Japanese roll dice for 1 submarine in 43 Sea Zone, round 3 : 1/1 hits, 0.17 expected hits 1 destroyer owned by the ANZAC lost in 43 Sea Zone 1 submarine owned by the Japanese lost in 43 Sea Zone Japanese win with no units remaining. Battle score for attacker is -1 Casualties for ANZAC: 1 destroyer Casualties for Japanese: 1 submarine Non Combat Move - ANZAC 1 infantry moved from New South Wales to 62 Sea Zone 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 62 Sea Zone to 54 Sea Zone 1 infantry moved from Queensland to 54 Sea Zone 2 infantry and 1 transport moved from 54 Sea Zone to 42 Sea Zone 2 infantry moved from 42 Sea Zone to Java 1 artillery moved from New South Wales to South Australia 1 fighter moved from Sumatra to India Place Units - ANZAC 3 Fortifications placed in Java 1 fighter and 1 mech_infantry placed in New South Wales Turn Complete - ANZAC ANZAC collect 14 PUs; end with 14 PUs Trigger ANZAC 1 Control Original And Malaya: ANZAC met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 19 PUs Trigger ANZAC Liberates DNG Turn2: ANZAC met a national objective for an additional 2 PUs; end with 21 PUs Objective ANZAC 2 Control Strategic Islands: ANZAC met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 26 PUs Combat Move - French Non Combat Move - French 1 infantry moved from French Central Africa to French Equatorial Africa 1 infantry moved from Trans-Jordan to Egypt 1 infantry moved from Tunisia to Algeria 1 infantry moved from Morocco to Algeria Turn Complete - FrenchCombat Hit Differential Summary :
Japanese regular : 0.67 ANZAC regular : 0.33I moved that Malta Air to Egypt that I spaced.
Yea, Good Idea about keeping USA out until Rd 3 in that scenario. You might bring it up to The Captain.
I also think the U-boats should get there 1st Rd D3 even if attacked by Subs with no DD present. I’ve mentioned it to him.
There having a gaming convention this week in Denmark I think. Maybe they’ll discuss it then.
I think they do several per year. Not sure where at in Germany you are, but maybe you could make one sometime. If you’re interested.
Oh yea, so next time you buy those Waffen dudes that didn’t place, you can just edit the PU total correctly and place them so they don’t keep showing up as unplaced.
You probably already know that :)
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Hi Gentlemen,
United States can declare War on any or all Axis Powers, if Japan unprovoked attacks any UK/ANSAC units/territories. Or if Japan unprovoked attacks or declares War on USA.
Either way, the US can declare War on any or all Axis Powers from the end of round 3.
We just checked the OOB 2ndE rulebook…
Sorry for the misunderstanding…
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Sir,
I need your scramble orders in SZ 110.
Furthermore I reduced my IPCs from 66 to 65 and placed the 1 SS-Waffen-Infantery from my wrong purchase from round 2.
I will do the same with the SS-Oberst once I will be able to place him.I also purchased an engineer, althoug I couldn´t find them in the rule book. Only the Combat Engineers are mentioned somewhere. I assume the regular Engineers have the same abilities, but less movement. In case the engineers are not available yet, I will replace it by a tank.
Very cool game so far and the new options and strategies that comes with the new units are amazing! I realy like it!
Also I am getting more and more used to the new unit-icons and they bring the game to a complete new level! -
I just noticed that I missed to move zhr italian AAA from Southern France to Bordeaux. I would move it in my German NCM, if ok for you.
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@Panzerstahl-Helm All Good. No scramble
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@Panzerstahl-Helm oh yea, so the “Engineer” is the Combat Engineer. There’s a fair amount of edit with them depending on how you use them.
Should be explained in Game Notes. Actually here ya go
italici18. Combat Engineer Adds the Combat Engineer Unit. Use Edit for moving Minor Factories and removing Landmines. Also for landing at Landing Strips. Land the Air Unit in a legal area and then edit after Non Combat Move. Unit Image courtesy of Hepps. sed text
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Game History
Round: 3 Research Technology - Germans Purchase Units - Germans triggerAttachmenEarly1941Red: has removed 1 Early1941 owned by Changer in Early 1941 triggerAttachmenLate1940: has removed 1 Late1940_red owned by Changer in Late 1940 triggerAttachmenEarly1941Red: Changer has 1 Early1941_red placed in Early 1941 triggerAttachmenLate1940: Changer has 1 Late1940 placed in Late 1940 Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Changing PUs for Germans from 66 to 65 EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode Germans buy 1 GermanUBoat, 1 German_Engineer, 1 Panzer_Grndrs, 2 artilleries, 1 bomber, 1 destroyer, 1 elite, 1 fighter, 4 infantry and 1 waffen_infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; Place Units - Germans Units in Germany being upgraded or consumed: 2 infantry 2 waffen_infantrys placed in Germany Combat Move - Germans Trigger RailMovementAutoPlaceGermans: Germans has 2 Rails placed in Germany 3 GermanUBoats, 1 Wolfpack, 1 battleship, 1 cruiser, 1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from 112 Sea Zone to 110 Sea Zone Combat - Germans Battle in 110 Sea Zone Germans attack with 3 GermanUBoats, 1 Wolfpack, 1 battleship, 1 cruiser, 1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber British defend with 1 destroyer Units damaged: 1 battleship owned by the Germans Germans win with 3 GermanUBoats, 1 Wolfpack, 1 battleship, 1 cruiser, 1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is 7 Casualties for British: 1 destroyer Non Combat Move - Germans Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode Trigger RailMovementAutoPlaceRemoveGermansItalyTakeover: has removed 2 Rails owned by Germans in Romania Trigger Urals Tank Unit: Russians has 1 armour placed in Urals 2 infantry moved from Denmark to 112 Sea Zone 1 carrier, 2 infantry and 1 transport moved from 112 Sea Zone to 110 Sea Zone 2 infantry moved from 110 Sea Zone to Normandy Bordeaux 1 fighter moved from Western Germany to Alexandria 1 tactical_bomber moved from Southern Italy to Alexandria 2 bombers, 3 fighters and 3 tactical_bombers moved from Western Germany to Syria 2 German_LCVs and 2 Rails moved from Germany to Romania 3 aaGuns, 3 armour, 1 artillery, 9 infantry and 2 waffen_infantrys moved from Slovakia Hungary to Romania 2 Waffen_Artys, 5 armour, 2 mech_infantrys and 1 waffen_infantry moved from Greater Southern Germany to Romania 1 Panzer_General and 2 waffen_infantrys moved from Germany to Romania 2 artilleries, 1 elite and 2 infantry moved from Germany to Slovakia Hungary 1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from Western Germany to France EDIT: 1 aaGun moved from Southern France to Normandy Bordeaux EDIT: 1 Panzer_General and 5 armour moved from Romania to 1st Panzer EDIT: 1 1stPanzerArmy moved from 1st Panzer to Romania 2 Me_109Ts and 1 carrier moved from 93 Sea Zone to 99 Sea Zone Place Units - Germans 1 Panzer_Grndrs and 1 fighter placed in Normandy Bordeaux 1 destroyer placed in 110 Sea Zone 1 GermanUBoat placed in 112 Sea Zone Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode 1 German_Engineer, 2 artilleries, 1 bomber, 1 elite and 4 infantry placed in Germany Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Removing units owned by Germans from Romania: 1 waffen_infantry EDIT: Adding units owned by Germans to Germany: 1 waffen_infantry EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode Germans undo move 4. 1 artillery, 1 bomber and 2 infantry placed in Western Germany 1 German_Engineer, 1 artillery, 1 elite and 2 infantry placed in Germany Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Removing units owned by Germans from Romania: 1 armour and 1 mech_infantry EDIT: Adding units owned by Germans to Western Germany: 1 armour and 1 mech_infantry EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode Turn Complete - Germans Germans collect 44 PUs; end with 44 PUs Trigger Germans AdvancedProduction: Germans met a national objective for an additional 12 PUs; end with 56 PUs Trigger Germans 5 Swedish Iron Ore: Germans met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 61 PUs Objective Germans 1 Trade with Russia: Germans met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 66 PUs -
@Panzerstahl-Helm Sweet :) So for 1st Panzer to be Active, it needs to change to “Panzer_General3”
I will add him on the commies turn.
Also, I’ll clarify the Game Notes for the Engineer. If I rename it, the name gets to long and crowds another unit out of Purchase screen.
Also there’s 5 different, as that’s how triplea does there max builds, so that’s a lot of work. I think it’ll be ok once people play it a bit but thanks for pointing that out. It didn’t occur to me.
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Game History
Round: 3 Purchase Units - Russians Note to players Russians: <body><b>It is Early 1941 and The Soviet Union has Formed 2 Tank Armies.<br />You may purchase 1 Tank General per turn.<b></body> Note to players Russians: <body><b>It is Early 1941 and The Soviet Union has Tankograd Up and Running !<br />Russia receives 1 Free Tank per turn as long as they control the Urals.<b></body> Trigger TankGeneral: buyTank_General added to productionRussians Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Removing units owned by Germans from 1st Panzer: 1 Panzer_General EDIT: Adding units owned by Germans to 1st Panzer: 1 Panzer_General3 EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode Russians buy 1 Soviet_Commisar, 1 armour, 1 elite, 5 infantry, 1 mech_infantry and 5 mine_unarmeds; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; Combat Move - Russians Trigger RailMovementAutoPlaceRussians: Russians has 1 Europe_Rail and 2 Rails placed in Russia Non Combat Move - Russians Trigger RailMovementAutoPlaceRemoveRussians: has removed 1 Europe_Rail and 2 Rails owned by Russians in Belarus 1 infantry moved from Western Ukraine to Bessarabia 1 elite moved from Bryansk to Western Ukraine 1 artillery and 2 infantry moved from Ukraine to Western Ukraine 3 infantry moved from Novgorod to Belarus 10 infantry moved from Belarus to Bryansk 1 infantry moved from Belarus to Bryansk 1 elite moved from Russia to Bryansk 1 Soviet_Commisar and 1 armour moved from Russia to Bryansk 1 infantry moved from Archangel to Smolensk 1 infantry moved from Nenetsia to Archangel 4 mine_unarmeds moved from Bryansk to Belarus 5 mine_unarmeds moved from Russia to Bryansk 1 Europe_Rail and 2 Rails moved from Russia to Buryatia 1 Europe_Rail, 2 Rails and 3 infantry moved from Buryatia to Belarus 6 infantry moved from Yenisey to Timguska 2 infantry moved from Buryatia to Yakut S.S.R. 1 armour moved from Urals to Russia Place Units - Russians Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Removing units owned by Russians from Belarus: 4 mine_unarmeds EDIT: Adding units owned by Changer to Belarus: 4 russian_mine_Oranges EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Removing units owned by Russians from Bryansk: 1 Soviet_Commisar, 1 armour and 1 mech_infantry EDIT: Adding units owned by Russians to 2nd Corps: 1 Soviet_Commisar, 1 armour, 1 infantry and 1 mech_infantry EDIT: Removing units owned by Russians from Bryansk: 11 infantry EDIT: Adding units owned by Russians to 1st Army Group: 1 1stCorps, 1 2ndCorps and 10 infantry EDIT: Removing units owned by Russians from Bryansk: 1 1stCorps EDIT: Removing units owned by Russians from 2nd Corps: 1 2ndCorps EDIT: Removing units owned by Russians from 1st Army Group: 1 1stSovietAG EDIT: Adding units owned by Russians to Bryansk: 1 1stSovietAG EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode 3 infantry placed in Ukraine 1 Soviet_Commisar, 1 armour, 1 elite, 2 infantry, 1 mech_infantry and 5 mine_unarmeds placed in Russia Turn Complete - Russians Russians collect 37 PUs; end with 37 PUsCombat Hit Differential Summary :
COMMENT: 4 Orange LMs in Belarus Armed @ E POL
COMMENT: 2nd Corps Forms in Bryansk and along with 1st Corps Create AG 1
COMMENT: 3rd Corps Forms in moscow
Bit of a busy turn. Think I got it all :)
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@Panzerstahl-Helm oh yea, so when you do Wolfpack Attacks, you need to use Edit or Dicebot.
Reason being is that right now I have triplea set up to give U-boats in a Wolfpack an A1 before regular Battle and if it hits it will Kill without giving the Defender a chance to Fire back.
Then the U-boats fire at 2 normally. This is to represent there Rd 1 hit at 3 attack and defense.
Paratroopers work similar.
I thought about removing it, but you have to Edit anyway, so for those that don’t want too Edit, it makes closer to EXP Rules.
It didn’t change anything in our Battle, just a heads up for the future :)
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