Nuclear Iran

[Guest]

……and polar vultures.

[ABWorsham4]

Why has this post taken the direction of attack people of faith?

[Guest]

It is not an attack, it is just another point of view.

[Jermofoot]

@Brain:

If you can believe in religion, you can believe anything.

That is a necessary and essential component to faith.

[Corbeau Blanc]

@ABWorsham:

Why has this post taken the direction of attack people of faith?

You can’t attack the immaginary.

[dezrtfish]

@Emperor_Taiki:

@dezrtfish:

I spent the last year having discussions with detained suspected terrorists.  I can’t get into allot of details.

can we have some more details?

I was the intelegence section chief for a detainee compound in Iraq.

[Jermofoot]

@dezrtfish:

Let me chime in on this discussion with some information I have learned firsthand.  I spent the last year having discussions with detained suspected terrorists.  I can’t get into allot of details.  But I can tell you I’ve learned allot about a sect of Shia Islam known as Imami Shia.  Imamist believe that the “Antichrist” is a force of evil they see this force manifested in the US and its colony Israel.  They believe that prior to the return or the Twelfth Imam - Muhammad ibn Hasan who has been in hiding for over 1000 years, the world must be descended into apocalypse.  The Imamists believe that war with the west is inevitable and the result will be the reemergence of the twelfth Imam as well as Jesus, the resurrection.

90% of Iran is Imamist Shia including Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and Ayatollah Khomeini.

I think this is as true as much as the US Christians that think the same thing will happen with the Second Coming and we will need to nuke some nonbelievers to achieve our rapture.

[ABWorsham4]

@Jermofoot:

@dezrtfish:

Let me chime in on this discussion with some information I have learned firsthand.  I spent the last year having discussions with detained suspected terrorists.  I can’t get into allot of details.  But I can tell you I’ve learned allot about a sect of Shia Islam known as Imami Shia.  Imamist believe that the “Antichrist” is a force of evil they see this force manifested in the US and its colony Israel.  They believe that prior to the return or the Twelfth Imam - Muhammad ibn Hasan who has been in hiding for over 1000 years, the world must be descended into apocalypse.  The Imamists believe that war with the west is inevitable and the result will be the reemergence of the twelfth Imam as well as Jesus, the resurrection.

90% of Iran is Imamist Shia including Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and Ayatollah Khomeini.

I think this is as true as much as the US Christians that think the same thing will happen with the Second Coming and we will need to nuke some nonbelievers to achieve our rapture.

There is no doubt that radials exist in every branch of faith.

[U-505]

The riots in Iran over the disputed election results are more than enough evidence to prove that the entire country isn’t totally united under a radical fundamentalist umbrella. They WILL be if we preemptively attack them, though.

[Jermofoot]

@ABWorsham:

@Jermofoot:

@dezrtfish:

Let me chime in on this discussion with some information I have learned firsthand.  I spent the last year having discussions with detained suspected terrorists.  I can’t get into allot of details.  But I can tell you I’ve learned allot about a sect of Shia Islam known as Imami Shia.  Imamist believe that the “Antichrist” is a force of evil they see this force manifested in the US and its colony Israel.  They believe that prior to the return or the Twelfth Imam - Muhammad ibn Hasan who has been in hiding for over 1000 years, the world must be descended into apocalypse.  The Imamists believe that war with the west is inevitable and the result will be the reemergence of the twelfth Imam as well as Jesus, the resurrection.

90% of Iran is Imamist Shia including Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and Ayatollah Khomeini.

I think this is as true as much as the US Christians that think the same thing will happen with the Second Coming and we will need to nuke some nonbelievers to achieve our rapture.

There is no doubt that radials exist in every branch of faith.

What I was trying to imply is that if they are around, they are by far a minority.

[dezrtfish]

LMAO, OK….

I will tell you that in that part of the world people aren’t as connected as you.  Schools in that part of the world are religious schools and they have no one to account to for what they teach.  There was a local national interpreter that I worked with who told me that when he was in grade school there was a day regularly where they burned the Israeli flag.

I’m not going to bother to try to convince anyone here or anywhere else, but I doubt you have any idea of what religious fundamentalism looks like or just how prevalent it is in the Middle East.

[Corbeau Blanc]

Well, If I take the 2nd presidential election between Bush and Kerry,
I think USA got a good look at what religious fundamentalism is, given that both candidate went to the Yales Universty and were buddies in Skull and Bones which has a strong protestant background.

Search a bit, you’ll see that that day there was no democraty, you basically had the choice between Skull and bones or bones and skull ( last quote not from me ).

Ironic also to see that a good part of theses guys familly fortunes were based on the opium market they were forcing upon China in the 1800’s , just to see them now condemn Afghans that produce opium. And how Iran is suddenly evil for trying to protect it’s frontiers with Irak which just pretty much got taken over?

Guys, there is a proverb: history repeat itself. You are playing a game on WWII and don’t even know how Roosevelt familly made it’s fortune, what were the economical interest of every actor and how it is still the same story today…  Also take alook at British interest in that zone backen then and which family/corporations were involved. Just get some books together, cross references, see who is controlling who. Is it THAT hard or you rather accept anything spoon fed as it is? Really, sometimes I’m discouraged.

[Jermofoot]

@dezrtfish:

LMAO, OK….

I will tell you that in that part of the world people aren’t as connected as you.  Schools in that part of the world are religious schools and they have no one to account to for what they teach.  There was a local national interpreter that I worked with who told me that when he was in grade school there was a day regularly where they burned the Israeli flag.

We’ve got schools teaching questionable topics (Intelligent Design, e.g.), religious schools with their own agenda, and I have no doubts parallels of flag burning and worse.  I don’t think any of what you said elicits a reaction of “oh crap, these crazies are going to get nukes and we have to stop them by force!”

I’m not going to bother to try to convince anyone here or anywhere else, but I doubt you have any idea of what religious fundamentalism looks like or just how prevalent it is in the Middle East.

I don’t need to go anywhere to see religious fundamentalism, it’s here in the US.  And those loons are saying the same things, but aren’t a majority.

[frimmel]

Image source and related discussion.

[Emperor_Taiki]

@dezrtfish:

LMAO, OK….

I will tell you that in that part of the world people aren’t as connected as you.  Schools in that part of the world are religious schools and they have no one to account to for what they teach.  There was a local national interpreter that I worked with who told me that when he was in grade school there was a day regularly where they burned the Israeli flag.

I’m not going to bother to try to convince anyone here or anywhere else, but I doubt you have any idea of what religious fundamentalism looks like or just how prevalent it is in the Middle East.

I agree dezrtfish, I have just read about islamic extremism and not expeirenced it first hand like you; But I think westerners and especailly Americans cannot begin to understand just how important religion is to these people. Being “religious” in the west is going to church every sunday. In many parts of the muslim world religion is the center of life, in these areas people are less materlistic and modern, they do things for relgious reasons alone. Islamic extremism is a serious problem, after all we are at war with the Islamists FYI.

[Emperor_Taiki]

@Jermofoot:

We’ve got schools teaching questionable topics (Intelligent Design, e.g.), religious schools with their own agenda, and I have no doubts parallels of flag burning and worse.

your right, ID is pretty bad, but if your saying christians at home are any where close to Islamists aboard your mistaken. We can deal with christians at home, they wil just go away with time. In the Muslim world, which will soon include parts of Europe, their is a movement that threatens to end civilization, if no one goes aften them they will do terrible things in their own country, but  eventualy will get a bomb and start blowing up cities.

[ABWorsham4]

If you were the leader of Israel, how would you react to Mahmoud Ahmadinejad threats?

[Jermofoot]

@Emperor_Taiki:

your right, ID is pretty bad, but if your saying christians at home are any where close to Islamists aboard your mistaken. We can deal with christians at home, they wil just go away with time. In the Muslim world, which will soon include parts of Europe, their is a movement that threatens to end civilization, if no one goes aften them they will do terrible things in their own country, but  eventualy will get a bomb and start blowing up cities.

I have a hard time thinking that what you say is true - if 1/6th of the people on this planet want a war, then they would have something to show for it.

@ABWorsham:

If you were the leader of Israel, how would you react to Mahmoud Ahmadinejad threats?

First, I would laugh at the puppet.
Then, I would laugh again at the thought of threats from a country with a puny military versus my country with military might bankrolled by the US.

However, that is not important.

First you must establish that any threats were made.
Then you must ask yourself why does it make any sense for a country with older, inferior, and less numerous weapons in a military of a far reduced budget and without nukes to threaten a country with a more advanced, better funded, trained and equipped military with nukes.
Finally, you must ask yourself why do we point to Iran and say “they are threatening Israel!!!” and say nothing and do not criticize when the more hawkish country does exactly that.

[Emperor_Taiki]

@Jermofoot:

I have a hard time thinking that what you say is true - if 1/6th of the people on this planet want a war, then they would have something to show for it.

Politcal Islam does have something to show, you must have missed out on this and the last century. And they dont have all muslim support, but they dont need it. It just takes a few “true beleivers” to kill thousands.

[dezrtfish]

So… I guess I’m missing something, where in the theory of intelligent design does it say anything that compares with “it is the duty of true Muslims to fight half the world to mutual destruction so that god will return to the earth and save everyone"?

I think there is a huge difference between Christian fundamentalism and Islam.  Every day in Iraq and other parts of the Middle East people are killed for not just having the wrong religion but for not being in the right sect of that religion.  I won’t say that never happens here, but when it does those people are looked at by the general public as freaks and legal action is taken, prison etc.  In the Middle East these types of people are often looked at as heroes with great moral strength.

You may think that incidences like that are rare, but I will tell you that the people there expect to be punished severely if they don’t live their lives within the confines of Islam.

I wish I could explain more about my experiences, but much of how I did my job is classified for good reason.