Operation Sealion a Possibility with AA1940 Europe?

[WILD BILL]

Besides fighting against Japan, China was in the middle of a civil war. The Nationalist (KMT) and the Communist (CCP). The US supported the KMT with a ton of military equipment including the flying tigers through the lend lease program in WWII. The conflict took quite a toll on the KMT and left them weaker, as much of the fighting against Japan was done in KMT territory. The CCP communist grew in size and strength. Ultimately the CCP took over after the war with influence from Russia. The KMT fled mainland China to Taiwan were it still governs. I don’t really know if the US could have stopped the communist take over but it does seem like we abandoned an ally. Today we have a lot of ties with China but most of that is recent development over the last 20 years. Imagine if China was more democratic. There is also that fear of China siding with the North Koreans in an Asian conflict. I would think that China would have to much to lose economically, but who knows stranger things have happened.

Sorry got way off topic.

[Adlertag]

are you a school teacher ?

[Guest]

Hey Aldertag, You are off topic.

[idk_iam_swiss]

Lol Wild bill is right though.

[WILD BILL]

@Adlertag:

are you a school teacher ?

Nope , went there a few years though.  :-D  There is so much info now a days via “the web”. You should try it.

[Guest]

Are you saying that I might be able to get all the info I need right here. :-D

[idk_iam_swiss]

thanks internet! :-D

[WILD BILL]

I’m not sure there’s much help for you BD but I’ll give you +1 just for trying

[Guest]

@WILD:

I’m not sure there’s much help for you BD but I’ll give you +1 just for trying

Wild Bill, that is the most accurate statement you have ever made. A +1 right back at you.

[idk_iam_swiss]

and a plus one to both of you for being agreeable!

[Canuck12]

Its a Krazy Karma fest over here! +1 to Everyone! Horray!!!

[LuckyDay]

@Twigley:

I don’t think they meant without US/UK aid - but I do think that by D-Day the Soviets had the game in the bag. Aided by SBRs from the western allies yes - but the land invasion of France did nothing but distract an already mortally wounded Germany. If the western allies had continued their aerial attacks - but not invaded Russia would still have won.

In fact - if in 1944 the US and UK had made peace with Germany - I think Russia would still have won. Germany had lost too much by then to be replaced. Not in terms of equipment - which German factories produced in large amounts but in terms of the loss of people; both Army groups south and centre - over 2/3 of their fighting forces - and the remaining third - battered and broken and trying to plug holes which were spread over 100’s of miles of  front.

I mean, don’t get me wrong - I’m a brit. But to say that the Russians NEEDED us to invade France in 1944 is wishful thinking. They were begging us to in 1942 - and we didn’t. Then arguably it may have made a difference.

Please note: I am NOT saying the Russians won WWII in europe without the western allies. Just that by 1944 they could have.

The UK/US liberated France - because by 1944 they were already preparing for the Cold War. To pretend it was out of ‘honour’ or ‘commitment’ is fanciful.

I know what you are saying Twigley, but to give the Soviets not DDay, but still the SBR campaign by the US/UK is huge.  Those two powers rained down destruction day and night, quite literally on Germany, forcing the Nazis to fight two sides.  If it was just the Soviet Bombers that would be different.

Had the Battle of Britain gone better for Hitler, he would have had more to throw at the Soviets to keep him on his timetable for attacking the US in 1945 and those US/UK bombings would not have thrown off his cross-Atlantic ship and aircraft production.

The landings in the North Atlantic and Italy were the Western Allies response to the Soviet’s asking for an invasion in '42 and while they were not landings into European mainland, they were direct attacks against the Axis that had to be countered by the Nazis in particular, pulling away troops and materials from the Eastern Front all the while while the SBR campaign continued to rage.

It really becomes a lot of conjecture…

[Guest]

Okay back to Operation Sea Lion

[souL]

A foolish plan in '40 and a foolish plan still today?

[Guest]

But if somehow there was a way to make it work, the world would be at my fingertips :evil:

[Omega]

Make Sea Lion a really bad gamble, like it probably was in 1940. A sort of : If I win, Axis win. If I lose, Axis lose. The kind of battle no one realy enjoy

[Guest]

You could be right

[Krupp Steel]

What about the inclusion of Airbases now?
The Germans could shuttle across 4 Inf, if the English Channel and mainland is within 3. Plus whatever naval invasion forces they can muster.
Idk, just something I thought of while reading something over at LARRY’S site about the airbases.
This Sealion would have to be second or third turn,depends how long France can last.

[WILD BILL]

Krump Steel, you must be referring to paratroopers. Germany would have to get a pretty lucky tech roll rd 1 or rd2, then I would say sea lion is a definite possibility. If you got paratroopers early and get to use them the round you get the tech (like AA50) then yea it could be like a sneak attack catching the UK off guard.

That and a bit of naval build-up for bombardment, and more inf via transport with out tipping you hand. Germany should also start with a decent size air force to take on the Britts head to head. You should also still get the +1 ftr & tac bmr bonus too. Another thing to think about is the UK is an island and should start with an air base. It could use some of its island based air force to defend its waters, so what ever you bring via navy could be in store for a pretty good fight.

I would still attack Paris first with Germany, maybe leave the mop up to Italy. Then if your in range go for it. Especially if The UK fails to protect itself, or make good use of its navy.

[Guest]

Ah yes, here it is idk_iam_swiss. Let’s talk about Sea Lion in the proper thread.