Complicated battle (scramble, kamikaze, surprise strike, amphibious assault)

[8thGuards]

ANZAC attacks the Philippines

Moves a CV, TAC, FTR, 2 DD and 2 SS into the Philippines seazone along with 3 fully loaded TRN

Japan has 2 SS in the sea zone, decides to use its kamikazes against the ANZAC surface fleet and scrambles the FTR and TAC that are on the Philippines to force a sea combat (otherwise it would have been an amphibious assault without sea combat).

1 the kamikazes eliminate 2 DD and damage the CV
2 both sides submarines decide to stay and fight, JAP scores one hit which ANZAC absorbs against the CV that is now sunk
3 as a result of no destroyers left, there are essentially 2 separate battles (2 SS vs 2 SS, and FTR+TAC vs FTR+TAC)
4 at the end, JAP has 1 SS left (kept the SS fighting to hopefully prevent amphibious assault, is that the right assumption?), ANZAC has one FTR left

What happens? Must ANZAC retreat its 3 loaded TRN since it has no attacking sea battle combat units left that could hit the remaining JAP SS or does it get to land on Philippines? And the ANZAC FTR has one movement point left and is thus basically lost. Japan kept its subs on the surface to prevent the landing and eliminate the ANZAC subs.

[The Pripet Martian]

Based on my reading of the Defenseless Transports rule, ANZAC transports must retreat or be destroyed by the Japanese sub. (Edit: And yes, the ANZAC fighter is destroyed.)

[simon33]

The Pripet Martian told you true.

A very unlucky battle there for the attackers. 2x2s + 1x0 were defeated by 2x1s with one defending sub remaining! I assume this is from a real game.

The transports aren’t allowed to unload in NCM either. This will almost certainly mean the destruction of the transports on Japan’s next turn, probably by the remaining sub.

Unless a CV is one space from SZ35, or can be moved there, the ANZAC fighter is lost. If ANZAC have a CV e.g. in SZ62 it MUST move.

I think that’s all.

[Tjoek]

Interesting scenario. I agree with @The-Pripet-Martian

@8thGuards said in Complicated battle (scramble, kamikaze, surprise strike, amphibious assault):

Japan has 2 SS in the sea zone, decides to use its kamikazes against the ANZAC surface fleet and scrambles the FTR and TAC that are on the Philippines to force a sea combat (otherwise it would have been an amphibious assault without sea combat).

One small correction though:
You don’t need the FTR to scramble to be able to fire Kamikaze strikes on an amphibious assault. The rules clearly state you can simply do so without the need of trigger a ‘normal’ sea combat first.

The Japanese player has the ability to make
a special defensive strike against Allied
surface warships. Japan is allowed to make
6 kamikaze strikes during the game. These
strikes can be made only in sea zones that
contain the Kamikaze symbol: those surrounding Japan,
Okinawa, Iwo Jima, Formosa, Marianas, and Philippines.
If an Allied player attacks Japanese units in or declares an
amphibious assault from one of these sea zones, the Japanese
player can announce at the beginning of this phase that he or
she intends to launch one or more kamikaze strikes in that sea
zone. They are resolved before any combat begins.

And

A kamikaze strike prevents offshore
bombardment supporting an amphibious assault in that
sea zone, whether or not the strike is successful

(this is at the top of page 16 of the Pacific 1940 rule book)

[Kreuzfeld]

I think the rules here are quite clear. but first, some clarifications:

1. attacking transports are never considered defenseless (since they can always chose to retreat). Defenseless transports is only a rule to make the end of the battle faster. If I have 1 attacking sub, and the defender have 10 TTs, it will take a while to roll all those hits. There is no point in forcing me to roll those hits, since the only possible outcome of the battle is 1 sub left and 10 dead TTs.
2. You have to clear the sea zone of units before you can land (P17 Pacific)
3. the sea battle isn’t over.
4. if a ship or plane rolls a hit, and there is no attacking Surface ships or planes to take the hit, it has to be assigned to transport-ships.
5. The correct continuation of the battle will have the following elements.
   a. Anzak can chose to press the attack. They will then roll their fighter which will miss. Then the defender will roll their sub, which will kill a transport on
   b. This will continue until either anzak retreats or the sub submerges.
   c. if japan chose to submerge while anzak has TTs left, anzak can land
   d. if anzak stays until they have lost their TTs, Japan can submerge to end the battle.

[A Former User]

I officially apologize for necromancing an old thread.
Since defender subs and transports can be engaged or ignored at attackers discretion, I assume the scramble is to activate the subs.
Now that defending aircraft gone, wouldn’t that rule reactivate?

[simon33]

@Mr-Kell said in Complicated battle (scramble, kamikaze, surprise strike, amphibious assault):

I officially apologize for necromancing an old thread.
Since defender subs and transports can be engaged or ignored at attackers discretion, I assume the scramble is to activate the subs.
Now that defending aircraft gone, wouldn’t that rule reactivate?

No it doesn’t. Why would it?

[A Former User]

@simon33
I found it.
Thanks so much for the reference.