Good idea. Definitely worth trying out.
@Argothair can you bomb or destroy the SC’s?
@aequitas-et-veritas Sure! A roll of 5 or 6 on any bomber can be sacrificed (no damage) to destroy a Supply Crate in the target territory. So go ahead and roll for all your bombers. and then if you rolled some 5s or 6s and want to spend them that way instead of assigning them as damage, you can.
It’s intentionally inefficient because a crate of oil, spareparts, aluminum, etc. is probably less visible, more mobile, and smaller than an average factory or airstrip, but they could still be blown up if you get lucky.
hmm…don’t understand with the bombing. One designates it’s target, AB, NB, Factory and ? Supply Crate ? Or are you saying you can take any bombing hit and apply it to the SC ?
Was thinking target SC and 5 and over kills it and everything else subtracts from it’s value ? No AA I’m thinking ?
Obviously can be killed in transport too if sunk
I wouldn’t bother subtracting from its value; that sounds tedious.
If you prefer designating a target in advance, I would say get through the anti-aircraft fire, and then if you make your run against the crate and roll a 4, 5, or 6, then the crate is destroyed. On a roll of 1, 2, or 3 the crate is unharmed.
And, yes, if transport is sunk, your supplies are too! Just like any cargo.
ok I’m just thinking how it works against current AB, NB, Factory. You can’t build as much when hit. So not quite the same then.
wow 4,5,6 is basically 50% that seems pretty steep. I think i’m still not quite grasping it. Can you do a play by play in detail :)
Don’t you have to target what you want to bomb before AA in regular game ? Am I wrong on that ?
ok I’m thinking you can only bomb it when it’s on land before it’s turned into dough. No AA fire and 1-3 kills it.
You’d still have to specify it as a target though ? For Bombing it and not w/e else is there ?
So does Canada have there own income ?
UK buying supply tokens T1 make sea lion defense weaker ?
Is it gonna make minor countries weaker buying or using transport that they need and don’t need ?
Can UK afford to spend money on supply’s and taking away Transports that they need for Europe invasions ?
Is Norway going to be the spot for allies landings every game now ?
I’m in favor of LL. I have played 3 different kinds.
I think if you buy a supply token it becomes a cargo ship. If you don’t want to use cargo ships then use a transport on top of supply token.
Also if you buy a supply token you receive the ship free.
Now you can bomb it in port. A roll of 1 kills it.
Any AA gun in port can Defend too. If it has a naval base then the base gets a AA gun defense shot to against a ship. This depends on if naval bases have built in aa guns.
Same if it’s at sea travel. If it’s with ships then it’s up to defender to choose. This depends on your ship casualty rules.
Also the cargo ship supply token should get to move 2.
Just idea here. I use a LL piece chart for Russian. Kinda like Sitedblood’s if that helps if cargo supply ships don’t work out in this game.
Another one is each country starts with cargo ships and if it makes it to an allies port then they receive the cargo. Could be a free piece or money. In one game I have cargo ships can move 6 but if an enemy ship is in path it stops it from moving. Route drawings is an option here but unlikely in this game.
I also always felt a ship should get to shore shoot it too. Just like a sub could sink it too.
Not trying to go off topic here but why not give Russia tankograd factory ? They receive 1 free tank per turn.
Plus they use LL chart. No allies allowed in Russia period.
Lend Lease
Just ideas to help if at all
I’m glad people are interested in this idea!
That said, I really don’t have strong opinions about the best way to adjudicate bombing runs on supply crates. That’s just not the part of the house rule that excites me. I would ideally want to keep the bombing rules very simple, so as not to require a lot of accounting or distract attention from other parts of the game, but if you have a set of complicated bombing rules that you and your friends enjoy, then go wild. There’s nothing wrong with that.
If you’re looking for my ideal bombing rules, I will try to explain them one more time:
These rules should generate slightly less economic payoff than ordinary strategic bombing…if your bomber gets through, you do an average of 2.5 damage, instead of 3.5 damage on a successful regular run. If you want more damage, you can allow hits on rolls of 3, as well.
As far as Canada having its own separate economy, yes, that’s certainly part of what I’m envisioning here, although you can use the Supply Crate rules even if you have no interest in switching up the British economies. I would ideally like to have four English-speaking powers:
British Empire would be UK + Iceland + Gibraltar + British Africa + India + Malaya + Hong Kong, and anything they conquer or liberate during the game. The Indian major factory is downgraded to two minor factories: one in India, and one in West India.
Canada would get +1 IPC each in British Columbia (allows purchase of a minor factory if desired), Yukon (becomes passible), and Newfoundland, as well as an NO for clearing Axis subs from the Atlantic worth about 3 IPCs/turn. Alberta would start with an extra tac bomber, Hudson Bay would start with an extra DD, and Ontario would start with an air base. If anyone knows of other NOs that would make sense thematically for Canada, I’m open to suggestions. Politically, Canada is treated like ANZAC, i.e., it starts off at war with Germany and Italy, and it will declare war on Japan as soon as Japan is at war with UK and/or ANZAC. It can declare an unprovoked war on Japan if desired, but that keeps the USA out of the war for longer.
The lack of Canadian income would make Britain slightly more vulnerable to Sea Lion…but you can now spend Indian income to protect London if you want, so there is still plenty of flexibility for the Allies in terms of which English-speaking countries will come under early attack. If you build nothing in India, you would wind up having more money to spend in London than in a standard OOB G40 game.
I see what your getting at with one UK economy. Money to counter sea lion T1
And counter India crush T2 or vice versa
Canada should have at least 7 income. This way they can buy a destroyer or tranny. Once they get the NO can buy a fig.
I don’t know what Canada makes now but you could make Quebec worth 3 for an upgraded factory. But highly unlikely unless it becomes the new London capital but I don’t think this rule is in game
I check on them and don’t see really another NO unless maybe give them a free supply token per turn. What I mean is from history if I’m correct they never received a cent from US and by 1943 were suppling half of the convoys and by end of 44 most of it.
Average Canadian citizen paid more in taxes than anybody else.
Her supplies went to the United Nations.
End of 44 it was 4 billion which was more dollar per capital than our LL.
Anyway that’s that.
So with 1 UK economy then they start with 45 income ? I’m going off of g40 Uk Europe 28
Uk India 17 if this is correct. Well if Canada makes 7 icps then u would subtract that from UK income of 45 = Uk 38 income.
Or are you looking at keeping Uk at 45 income and giving Canada 7 so there’s no bid now also with your tweaks ?
Now if u upgrade to a major in India will they be strong enough down the road to deny Japan a victory or axis ?
@SS-GEN That’s right, British economy would start at 28 + 17 - 7 = 38 IPCs.
You can spend 20 of that on upgrading the India factory on UK1 plus 18 IPCs on 6 infantry for India on UK1 if you really want to…but now London has zero defense for sea lion, and if London falls then you are not going to be able to use the India factories!
More realistically, if Japan leaves India alone and Germany leaves London alone then maybe by uk3 or so you can upgrade the India factory and hold India for the full game.
@Argothair said in Supply Token for Lend-Lease:
@SS-GEN That’s right, British economy would start at 28 + 17 - 7 = 38 IPCs.
You can spend 20 of that on upgrading the India factory on UK1 plus 18 IPCs on 6 infantry for India on UK1 if you really want to…but now London has zero defense for sea lion, and if London falls then you are not going to be able to use the India factories!
More realistically, if Japan leaves India alone and Germany leaves London alone then maybe by uk3 or so you can upgrade the India factory and hold India for the full game.
Right.
Right on. I see what your saying now. I think triplea should support this. I’ll look into it and see what it would take to add it as an option.
I just reread everything and think the only thing triplea can’t do is the different bombing hits. It will have to be treated as if it’s a minor factory with no ability to repair.
Shouldn’t be too complicated since that’s how the other bombing targets work.
Think damage would be ok too, as in only part of the cargo got destroyed, but if one was playing ftf your bombing rules would work fine as well.
Maybe if it’s damaged it can’t be looted. Not sure if that could be done or not.
At any rate, i think it’s a cool idea :)
Argo
Here’s a few more NOs that I’ve played in other games for Canada.
2 icps for 1 warship in N Atlantic certain szs
2 icps for 1 warship in Atlantic certain szs
Same as no axis subs in certain sea zones maybe and or need a ship in these szs to get money
3 icps when US is at war with Axis this would take a load off Canada’s lend lease historically
Or as mentioned give Canada a 1 free supply token per turn
There’s a few more but mostly if allies in certain territories Canada receives more money but I
Don’t like them mostly unless it’s an actual
Canadain ground unit there. Like if an Canada inf gets in Normandy receive 2 or 3 icps.
Or maybe give Canada 3 icps per turn if UK Europe controls all there territories but don’t know how deep you want to go.
In one game I’ve seen Canada collect up to 13 icps per turn and another game up to 20 which to me was crazy. Canada was taking African territories
Revisiting this and while still a cool idea, I wonder how effective it would be. I don’t think you can send a convoy to Murmansk without US help. UK won’t be strong enough. Also you’d have to hold Lenningrad through Rd5 at least.
Ideally the 111 fleet survives and retreats to Iceland. Hopefully 106 as well. If not Canada can still buy 2 tokens, the US can build a CV and a couple DDs and Ftrs. Move some of it’s Pacific Fleet through Panama.
Rd2 (assuming Japan has attacked) the US can pick up the Tokens and head to Iceland. If needed you can fly a Ftr or two there as well.
Rd3 will put you in SZ125. This is probably the danger zone depending on what the Kriegsmarine and Luftwaffe are doing but you should be strong enough. If not or looks as if Lenningrad isn’t gonna hold, go to UK instead.
Rd 4 drop your stuff at Lenningrad. Rd 5 Russia has an extra 10 bucks to spend that turn. If you have another convoy behind it you can get another 10 bucks Rd 6. A couple DDs and 3 Ftrs in Lenningrad should be enough to protect the Trprt and you can leave most of your strength in 125.
I guess it depends on if Germany goes south or not and if an extra 10 bucks a turn is worth it to hold Lenningrad. Sometimes Russia will get into Scandanavia so maybe you can hold and the extra dough and Ftrs will be just enough to give Moscow a chance.
You could also activate Persia and get dough to stalingrad by Rd7. So maybe another 10 bucks before Moscow gets attacked. A big investment for the Allies for sure, but you can always send the dough to UK if Lennin and stalin have fallen.
Obviously the best part of it is versus flying all Ftrs over, is Russia can spend it on what it wants and give it more of a counterattack capability. And if Germany does try and stop it, it forces him to spend more dough in the Atlantic (which helps Russia) and or go North (which would help the Persia/Stalingrad route).
Another concern is Germany could buy 4 Tokens after France falls and send them to Italy. Could end up with a large canopener Force or threaten the Med. Idk, just have to give it a shot. Anyway gonna try and add it to triplea and see what happens. :)
