@Cmdr:
Anyone ever try the following?
3 Infantry from India to FIC
Fighter from SZ 35 to FIC?Not the best odds, but not the worst either. Potential to bag a Japanese fighter on England 1 can be nice. Especially if Russia did well. And at worst, India is unassailable on Japan 1! (Assuming you send Destroyer/Carrier to SZ 59 so no infantry can be brought down to India.)
when it works, it’s awesome
When it fails, it sucks.
You’re risking defensive pieces (UK inf, ftr)
to kill defensive pieces (inf, ftr)
Is that a good trade for the allies early in the game?
They should conserve their units, IMHO.
Unless you want to go after borneo or other targets.
I’ve done this attack and it went horribly wrong for UK.
Not worth the risk, IMHO. I doubt I’d ever do it again.
My opponent tried this to me in a current game
He got 1 hit first round, dicey treated me well and I got 3 hits (not that outrageous, mind you)
Ouch!
@Cmdr:
Anyone ever try the following?
3 Infantry from India to FIC
Fighter from SZ 35 to FIC?Not the best odds, but not the worst either. Potential to bag a Japanese fighter on England 1 can be nice. Especially if Russia did well. And at worst, India is unassailable on Japan 1! (Assuming you send Destroyer/Carrier to SZ 59 so no infantry can be brought down to India.)
This is one of Nix’s trademark moves.
When it works, it really slows Japan down. When it fails badly, the Southern Avenue is wide open for Japan (though they lack the forces to fully capitalize on that for a few turns… beyond a quick grab of India with 1 INF.
The average result though is just a removal of land units from Japan that prevents their use for:
1. Taking India
2. Attacking China
3. Protecting FIGs landed in FIC.
The move must be combined with sinking the SZ59 TRN to be effective.
It just seems like there are better things to do with that fighter, I don’t know how else to put it. Maybe it’s worth pursuing if Anglo was taken very lightly by like 1 tank and you don’t really want to send the fighter all the way out to Pearl.
It actually works pretty well…
When it works :-P
See those kinds of strategies are my pet peeves. It works when it works, and when it doesn’t work, well it doesn’t work! It’s kind of like flipping a coin and if it’s heads you win and when it’s tails you lose -_-! I prefer the variety where it’s heads you win, and tails you still win even if it’s not by as big a margin :evil:
Actually, even when it fails, it leave Japan severely weakened in Asia on J1.
Call it the Revised version of the Kwangtung Maneuver from Classic :-)
Hmm I’ve never played classic so I don’t get the analogy :cry:
Well, even if it results in just the loss of 2 infantry in FIC, without the Transport in SZ 59, England can put an IC in India on UK 1 without fear of it falling to Japan on J1 or J2. That means Russia can reinforce SInkiang and America can put an IC htere. That’s 5 units a round on the Japanese front from UK/USA with an aggressive American fleet in the Pacific forcing Japan to retreat or build navy, you might have a good KJF strat to rival the SZ 30 unification.
I dont know… I’d be sorely tempted as Japan to go for an Indian IC ASAP, regardless of initial costs. Too much trouble if you let it stand for more than three rounds, and if you can bag it on J2, well, Russia just got into a whole lot of trouble…
Sink the UK boats, position whatever trannies you have left in the islands, so they are picking up troops for the next round… yeah…
I can do a pearl super light (destroyer, bomber, sub if it survived which is likely if you only sent the one english sub after it, and maybe a fighter) and just hope for some decent hits, tho really its not all that important…
Send one BB to my inner seazone, if necessary, to protect my next round trannies. If not, it goes to pearl.
I hit china with five men and two figs, or just one if you actually nailed mine in the first round attack, not too likely tho, and 5 inf 1 fig is usually enough to hit china anyhow.
The southern BB heads off to nail your destroyer/AC, along with 2fig and the AC from the inner islands. One tranny goes to philipines and gets 2 inf. If i survived FIC, then can drop off there, tho its safer to just park the tranny within range of India next to the BB in the kwangtang killzone. The southern AC heads to indian waters with a plane to block passage of your australian tranny, and hopefully kill the indian tranny if you used it to ferry an extra guy in from persia (yay for germany!). If not, its one less inf we have to worry about. Or if the indian tranny is ineffective as far as new troops, i just hunt down your loaded aussy tranny… if its headed to india that is…
Now we are ready to rock… with any luck, we sank a boat or two out in pearl and our bomber at least survived and is either in Japan (FIC survived) or Okinawa… We have 3 to 4 figs in range of India. We have a BB in range of India as well as a tranny with two inf. We also have the possibility of surviving units in FIC, which wont be sent to China. And best of all, you had to buy that IC before you know the result…
On J2, I can go all in after India… sure you have an AA, but truth is, most of the time you wont hit a plane… maybe one if you are lucky. You might have been funneling troops down from russia, but if Germany sees this going on, you can bet they are going full force against their eastern front. On J2 I should be able to at least do some good damage to your inf if I dont take it outright. (I will lose fighters if odds are good for taking and holding.) If not, on J3 I have three transports within range with full troop loads for a second assault, and this time I will be bringing my second battleship as well.
Now,… thats in response to an American IC on US1… if they dont build it, I can take an extra round to funnel in the troops and take with far less risk on J3. Thanks for the IC.
England 2:
India has: IC, AA Gun, 5 Infantry, 2 Fighters, Bomber
Sinkiang has: 2 US Infantry, 4 USSR Infantry, 2 USSR Fighters, 1 USSR Armor, IC
Buryatia has: 6 USSR Infantry
How do you plan to bag the Indian IC?
The Indian IC isn’t that hard to topple if you ignore the other areas and plan for a J3 strike, even if reinforced by all the fighter units available. You have 5’ish inf from China, then 8 troops from Japan proper, then you have 2 bb shots and all the airforce on J3.
Yea, but even if you magically can get india on J3, you’ve lost Manchuria, Kwangtung and FIC and you have American ICs in Sinkiang and China with a few Russian tanks primed to liberate India before you can build on it, but before England loses the chance to build on it.
Meanwhile, America’s been steadily building fleet off setting your slight advantage you start with.
@Cmdr:
Well, even if it results in just the loss of 2 infantry in FIC, without the Transport in SZ 59, England can put an IC in India on UK 1 without fear of it falling to Japan on J1 or J2.
Not necessarily. 1 out of every 6 times the singular DD dies without sinking the sz59 TP. As Japan, would I be willing to risk fighters against your AA for the chance to knock out the India IC for a turn(at least) and completely wipe out all UK units in Asia by J1. Maaaaybe. You have to build the IC before seeing the result of the sz59 combat so where would you put it if the sz59 TP survives?
And that’s just 15% of the time, yes, but when the sz59 TP does sink and you couple it with this:
@Cmdr:
England 2:
India has: IC, AA Gun, 5 Infantry, 2 Fighters, Bomber
Sinkiang has: 2 US Infantry, 4 USSR Infantry, 2 USSR Fighters, 1 USSR Armor, IC
Buryatia has: 6 USSR InfantryHow do you plan to bag the Indian IC?
It seems like a lot of Russian firepower absent from Europe. Makes a weaker Russia have to deal with a Germany that is making mid-40’s thanks to you not counterattacking Egypt. Plus, the UK is at least 1 turn behind getting units into Europe, they have to do it while also spending money in India and with less money from the quick loss of African IPC’s to Germany’s blitzing armor in Egypt.
Every strategy is a surefire winner until you take into account the possible downsides or the fact that your opponent actually gets to build and move units on their turn.
U-505
You missed that it is Aircraft Carrier, Destroyer vs Transport in SZ 59. That is almost a guaranteed sinking of the Japanese transport.
And yes, you have 1 less armor in Europe then you normally would
Remember the fighters from Sinkiang can still hit W. Russia, Ukraine, Karelia and Archangelsk because once those ICs are running, you don’t need the fighters on defense anymore. 3 out, 1 back.
Well that alleviates the sz59 problem, but in order to have the 2 Russian fighters in India by UK2 their attacks are limited to Ukraine only and they would have to have been based out of Cauc to do it. If they were in Russia starting on R2 they can’t participate in any attacks in Europe in order to get to India. And on the return trip they are limited again to only being used in Ukraine.
With that you are trading expensive Russian offensive ground units in Europe for 2 straight turns against a Germany that is using only air and infantry to trade Kar/Belo/Ukr with and is also outproducing Russia by almost double.
It seems to me that you are hamstringing Russia for the sake of hamstringing Japan. The Allies are assaulting Japanese Asian territories from 3 different directions but Japan can stack in Kwang and beat back each front one at a time while Russia will be faced with 1 big stack of increasingly overwhelming German units. Sounds like Russia would be getting the worse end of that stick.
2 Russian Fighters in Sinkiang, no India. That way they can hit Ukraine, W. Russia, Karelia and Archangelsk on R2.
1 Russian Armor in India. In case Japan forgets and leaves it open for a Russian blitz. =)
Basically, you are only removing 1 Russian Armor from the German front on R1. The rest of the equipment either couldn’t get to the German front by R2 or can fly there anyway. Why land the fighters in Caucauss? You’re not attacking Germany anyway! Why not land them in Sinkiang? If Japan gets all screwy, you can always for go any Russian involvement because Japan built 100% offensive fleet and not be down a single unit. meanwhile, Japan’s down an entire rounds income used on submarines and destroyers that now will serve no purpose.
@Cmdr:
Why land the fighters in Caucauss?
Because you still have a Med Fleet on G1, and you are not a Ukraine R1 person either Jen. That means a potential serious G1 attack on Caucuses.
My bad. I misread your post.
@Cmdr:
Basically, you are only removing 1 Russian Armor from the German front on R1.
Yes, but you are also removing 2 Russian fighters from Europe for 2 turns while they are going to Sink on R2 and coming back on R3. They can only hit Ukraine on the return trip.
@Cmdr:
Why land the fighters in Caucauss? You’re not attacking Germany anyway!
Because if you want them to be able to participate in any combat in europe on R2 before landing them in Sink they have to be based out of Cauc at the beginning of R2 and even then they can only attack Ukraine. And you aren’t attacking Germany!? You mean you are leaving Kar/Belo/Ukr in German hands while your fighters are in Sink?
U-505,
I NEVER SAID THE FIGHTERS WERE GOING TO INDIA. Sinkiang is a completely different territory. The Fighters are not lost to Russia’s use against Germany on Russia 2.
Switch:
As I see it, Caucasus has 6 Infantry, Artillery, 5 Armor, AA Gun and Industrial Complex.
Germany can hit it, but that’s going to be one serious damage to the German war machine.
Germany has 4 Infantry, Artillery, 4 Armor, Battleship, 5 Fighters and a Bomber that can reach Caucasus on G1
Yea, you have a 90% chance to win. Then again, even with the two Russian fighters there you have a very good chance to win. It’s all a matter of how many fighters do you want to lose and how badly would you like the British Navy to sail through the Suez Canal?
Note, that with the SAME attacking force, but add the 2 Russian fighters, Germany has a 50% chance to win with Armor, Fighter, Bomber left as opposed to without the Russian Fighters Germany winning with Armor, 3 Fighters, Bomber left.
(Assumed: AA Gun got 1 hit out of 5 shots. Battleship hit.)
Guess what I am saying is I don’t think the Germans are going to risk losing that much for the potential of killing off some Russian armies at the expense of not hitting the fleet, leaving England with the Suez open and both of their original battleships.
