17L BM2.0 Oysteilo (x) vs Gamerman01

[oysteilo]

@Gamerman01:

@Gamerman01:

90% of players I encounter are unaware of the rules about the proper order of conducting combat
All SBR is to be rolled first
Then all amphibious assaults
All the other battles rolled only after that

I guess you are among the 90%.  You should have rolled Ethiopia first on UK1

OK. I read your original post, then read it again, but couldn’t quite figure out what you were refering to…… Now I understand and yes I was one of the 90%, now i am one of the 10%. So if you have multiple battles to do it goes like this
1. Any bombing raids has priority 1 and must be done first
2. Any amphibious assults has priority 2 and is second
3. All other battles

I will respect the rules from now on. However, it is not obvious to me in which situations this might be important. Any ideas? And thanks for bringing this to my attention

[gamerman01]

Great!  Thank you for responding.  Some people just ignore it probably because they don’t understand it.

Funcioneta (the Spaniard) had to point it out to me several years ago - I was also oblivious

If you think about it, there are some times where not following this rule would give the attacker an unfair advantage, because it is a restriction on the player.
But like you said, first and foremost it’s about following the rules because they are the rules

I’ll make up an example for you as requested:

[gamerman01]

This is certainly not the only consideration, but I would point out to you that an amphibious assault could involve a lot of non-amphibious units.

For example, maybe you are attacking Alexandria (with the UK) with over-land units (from Tobruk).
You also attack Egypt with mostly over-land units, but there are also 2 transports unloading amphibiously.  it is a low percentage (say 30-40%) attack.  There are no Axis transports in the Med.  There is an IC on Egypt.

The rules dictate that you have to conduct the battle in Egypt first because it is an amphibious assault.
If you could conduct combat in whatever order you wished, you would have rolled Alexandria first because you want to know if the Axis could have an immediate counter-attack on Egypt using the ground units on Alexandria (and Alexandria is a valid landing spot for Axis aircraft counterattacking Egypt if you don’t take over Alexandria).  If the attack on Alexandria fails, you would be more apt to retreat from Egypt and not take as much risk, because you will not be able to hold Egypt anyway.

(I’m sure you can punch holes in my example, but you get the idea)

[gamerman01]

I could come up with different examples, ones involving SBR and such, but you’re a smart guy and probably get the picture.

Anyway, it’s best to just follow the rules all the time and point it out to your opponents as well, because once in a while it could make a HUGE difference and you could have an unnecessary disagreement, I’m sure you understand.

Thanks again

[gamerman01]

OK, another reason for the rule is because it is possible to SBR a territory and also invade it at the same time.

If the invasion succeeds, the territory would then be friendly, and if you hadn’t rolled the SBR yet, what do you do?  So the rule dictates that you roll the bombing before you roll the invasion, so it is possible that you just bombed your own factory (if the invasion surprises you and succeeds)

[oysteilo]

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 Balanced Mod, version: 2.0

Game History

Round: 1

Purchase Units - ANZAC
            ANZAC buy 1 infantry and 1 transport; Remaining resources: 0 PUs;

Combat Move - ANZAC

Non Combat Move - ANZAC
            2 infantry moved from New South Wales to 62 Sea Zone
            2 infantry and 1 transport moved from 62 Sea Zone to 42 Sea Zone
            2 infantry moved from 42 Sea Zone to Java
                  ANZAC take Java from Dutch
            1 fighter moved from Queensland to Sumatra
            1 fighter moved from New Zealand to 63 Sea Zone
            1 fighter moved from 63 Sea Zone to Queensland
            1 cruiser moved from 63 Sea Zone to 26 Sea Zone
            2 aaGuns moved from New South Wales to Queensland
            1 destroyer moved from 62 Sea Zone to 54 Sea Zone
            1 fighter moved from New Zealand to Queensland

Place Units - ANZAC
            1 infantry placed in New South Wales
            1 transport placed in 62 Sea Zone

Turn Complete - ANZAC
            ANZAC collect 14 PUs; end with 14 PUs total

triplea_39828_ANZ1.tsvg

[oysteilo]

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 Balanced Mod, version: 2.0

Game History

Round: 1

Combat Move - French
            1 infantry moved from Tunisia to Libya
                  French take Libya from Italians
            1 infantry moved from Normandy Bordeaux to Holland Belgium
                  French take Holland Belgium from Germans
            1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from Southern France to Northern Italy

Combat - French
            Battle in Northern Italy
                French attack with 1 artillery and 1 infantry
                Italians defend with 1 aaGun, 1 factory_major and 4 infantry
                1 artillery owned by the French retreated to Southern France
                Italians win with 3 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 5
                Casualties for French: 1 infantry
                Casualties for Italians: 1 aaGun and 1 infantry

Non Combat Move - French
            1 cruiser and 1 destroyer moved from 93 Sea Zone to 92 Sea Zone
            1 cruiser moved from 110 Sea Zone to 92 Sea Zone
            1 destroyer moved from 72 Sea Zone to 76 Sea Zone
            1 fighter moved from United Kingdom to Gibraltar
            1 infantry moved from Morocco to Algeria
            1 infantry moved from French West Africa to French Central Africa
            1 infantry moved from Syria to Trans-Jordan

Turn Complete - French

triplea_39828_Fre1.tsvg

[oysteilo]

thanks for the answers. I will try my best to obey the rules from now on. I learn new things every time with this game. So many possibilities

Feel free to edit N. Italy if you like. I will retreat no matter what you select

[gamerman01]

Absolutely

[gamerman01]

You double hit?  That is sick

[gamerman01]

So, not a good round 1 for me.  I’ll have to do better

[oysteilo]

@Gamerman01:

You double hit?  That is sick

Yeah, I figured I might as well have a go at the italiens and I was rewarded with a double hit and 1 hit in return

For sure 1-0 for allies Round 1, more to come

[gamerman01]

Yeah I would have probably tried the same thing.  I’m always looking to attack with French in the first round.  At least you didn’t go for Paris and wipe them out (without taking Paris and collecting the money, of course)

[oysteilo]

@Gamerman01:

Yeah I would have probably tried the same thing.  I’m always looking to attack with French in the first round.  At least you didn’t go for Paris and wipe them out (without taking Paris and collecting the money, of course)

I think it is the right move. No point in sitting in southern france and waiting for the capital punishment that is comming……

[gamerman01]

OK, first time on the Axis side in BM, I see why the change was made for BM 3
Too many NO’s for the Russians, I said from the first time I saw BM rules…

[gamerman01]

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 Balanced Mod, version: 2.0

Game History

Round: 2

Research Technology - Germans

Purchase Units - Germans
            Germans buy 2 destroyers, 1 fighter, 10 infantry and 2 submarines; Remaining resources: 0 PUs;

Combat Move - Germans
            2 infantry moved from Western Germany to Holland Belgium
            1 mech_infantry moved from France to Southern France
            1 artillery moved from France to Southern France
            2 artilleries moved from France to Normandy Bordeaux
            1 infantry moved from Bulgaria to Greece
            1 infantry moved from Bulgaria to Greece
            1 infantry moved from Bulgaria to Greece
            1 tactical_bomber moved from Southern Italy to Greece
            1 fighter moved from Western Germany to Greece
            1 tactical_bomber moved from Western Germany to Greece
            1 armour moved from Yugoslavia to Greece
            1 armour moved from France to Southern France
            1 tactical_bomber moved from Western Germany to Southern France
            1 armour moved from France to Normandy Bordeaux
            1 tactical_bomber moved from Western Germany to Normandy Bordeaux
            1 fighter moved from Western Germany to Greece
            1 armour moved from France to Holland Belgium
            1 tactical_bomber moved from Western Germany to Holland Belgium
            1 fighter moved from Western Germany to Greece
            1 bomber moved from Western Germany to Scotland
            1 bomber moved from Western Germany to Greece

Combat - Germans
            Strategic bombing raid in Scotland
                Bombing raid in Scotland rolls: 8 and causes: 6 damage to unit: airfield
                Bombing raid in Scotland causes 6 damage total.
            Battle in Holland Belgium
                Germans attack with 1 armour, 2 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber
                French defend with 1 infantry
                Germans win, taking Holland Belgium from French with 1 armour, 2 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3
                Casualties for French: 1 infantry
            Battle in Normandy Bordeaux
                Germans attack with 1 armour, 2 artilleries and 1 tactical_bomber
                French defend with 1 artillery, 1 factory_minor and 1 harbour
                Germans win, taking Normandy Bordeaux from French with 1 armour, 2 artilleries and 1 tactical_bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is 4
                Casualties for French: 1 artillery
            Battle in Southern France
                Germans attack with 1 armour, 1 artillery, 1 mech_infantry and 1 tactical_bomber
                French defend with 1 artillery, 1 factory_minor and 1 harbour
                Germans win, taking Southern France from French with 1 armour, 1 mech_infantry and 1 tactical_bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is 0
                Casualties for French: 1 artillery
                Casualties for Germans: 1 artillery
            Battle in Greece
                Germans attack with 1 armour, 1 bomber, 3 fighters, 3 infantry and 2 tactical_bombers
                Neutral_Allies defend with 4 infantry
                Germans win, taking Greece from Neutral_Allies with 1 armour, 1 bomber, 3 fighters, 1 infantry and 2 tactical_bombers remaining. Battle score for attacker is 6
                Casualties for Germans: 2 infantry
                Casualties for Neutral_Allies: 4 infantry

Non Combat Move - Germans
            Trigger Germans Occupies Southern France: Setting switch to false for conditionAttachment_French_Territory_May_Turn_Vichy_Switch attached to French
            3 fighters moved from Greece to Southern Italy
            1 tactical_bomber moved from Greece to Western Germany
            1 tactical_bomber moved from Greece to Southern Italy
            1 bomber moved from Scotland to Western Germany
            1 tactical_bomber moved from Normandy Bordeaux to Western Germany
            1 infantry moved from Yugoslavia to 97 Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from Bulgaria to Romania
            3 aaGuns, 3 artilleries and 12 infantry moved from Slovakia Hungary to Romania
            4 infantry moved from Yugoslavia to Romania
            2 artilleries moved from Yugoslavia to Romania
            1 aaGun, 3 artilleries and 4 infantry moved from Germany to Poland
            1 tactical_bomber moved from Southern France to Western Germany
            1 tactical_bomber moved from Holland Belgium to Western Germany
            2 infantry moved from Norway to Finland
            1 cruiser and 1 transport moved from 113 Sea Zone to 112 Sea Zone
            1 bomber moved from Greece to Western Germany
            1 mech_infantry moved from Yugoslavia to Poland
            1 mech_infantry moved from Yugoslavia to Romania
            1 armour moved from Yugoslavia to Poland
            1 mech_infantry moved from Yugoslavia to Poland
            1 armour moved from Yugoslavia to Romania
            1 armour moved from Bulgaria to Romania
            1 submarine moved from 111 Sea Zone to 124 Sea Zone
            1 submarine moved from 106 Sea Zone to 108 Sea Zone
            1 submarine moved from 106 Sea Zone to 118 Sea Zone
            1 aaGun moved from France to Normandy Bordeaux
            1 aaGun moved from France to Holland Belgium

Place Units - Germans
            1 fighter and 2 infantry placed in Western Germany
            2 destroyers and 2 submarines placed in 112 Sea Zone
            8 infantry placed in Germany
            Turning on Edit Mode
            EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode

Turn Complete - Germans
            Germans collect 46 PUs; end with 46 PUs total
            Trigger Germans 5 Swedish Iron Ore: Germans met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 51 PUs
            Objective Germans 1 Trade with Russia: Germans met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 56 PUs

triplea_39828_Ger2.tsvg

[oysteilo]

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 Balanced Mod, version: 2.0

Game History

Round: 2

Purchase Units - Russians
            Russians buy 8 infantry, 1 marine and 2 mech_infantrys; Remaining resources: 0 PUs;

Combat Move - Russians

Non Combat Move - Russians
            1 infantry moved from Novgorod to Karelia
            1 infantry moved from Novgorod to Vyborg
            1 artillery moved from Novgorod to Belarus
            2 armour and 1 mech_infantry moved from Bryansk to Novgorod
            1 infantry moved from Novgorod to Belarus
            2 aaGuns moved from Bryansk to Western Ukraine
            1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from Bryansk to Western Ukraine
            1 artillery and 3 infantry moved from Russia to Bryansk
            1 infantry moved from Rostov to Ukraine
            3 artilleries moved from Ukraine to Western Ukraine
            1 cruiser moved from 114 Sea Zone to 115 Sea Zone
            2 fighters and 1 tactical_bomber moved from Russia to Novgorod
            2 aaGuns and 12 infantry moved from Buryatia to Amur
            6 infantry moved from Yakut S.S.R. to Yenisey
            1 infantry moved from Western Ukraine to Eastern Poland
            1 infantry moved from Bessarabia to Western Ukraine

Place Units - Russians
            1 infantry placed in Ukraine
            1 marine and 2 mech_infantrys placed in Novgorod
            7 infantry placed in Russia

Turn Complete - Russians
            Russians collect 37 PUs; end with 37 PUs total
            Turning on Edit Mode
            EDIT: Removing units owned by Russians from 124 Sea Zone: 1 submarine
            EDIT: Adding units owned by Russians to 117 Sea Zone: 1 submarine
            EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode

triplea_39828_Rus2.tsvg

[gamerman01]

Ah, first person other than me I’ve seen buy a Russian marine

[gamerman01]

TripleA Move Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 Balanced Mod, version: 2.0

Game History

Round: 2

Purchase Units - Japanese
            Japanese buy 1 carrier, 1 destroyer, 1 infantry and 2 submarines; Remaining resources: 6 SuicideAttackTokens; 0 PUs;

Politics - Japanese
            Japanese takes Political Action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies
                Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Japanese and Americans from Neutrality to War
                Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Japanese and British from Neutrality to War
                Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Japanese and UK_Pacific from Neutrality to War
                Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Japanese and ANZAC from Neutrality to War
                Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Japanese and Dutch from Neutrality to War
                Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Japanese and French from Neutrality to War
                Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Germans and Americans from Neutrality to War
                Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Italians and Americans from Neutrality to War
                Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Chinese and Americans from Neutrality to Allied
                Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Chinese and British from Neutrality to Allied
                Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Chinese and UK_Pacific from Concordant to Allied
                Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Chinese and French from Neutrality to Allied
                Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Chinese and ANZAC from Neutrality to Allied
                Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Chinese and Dutch from Neutrality to Friendly
                Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for British and Americans from Neutrality to Allied
                Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for UK_Pacific and Americans from Neutrality to Allied
                Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for ANZAC and Americans from Neutrality to Allied
                Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Americans and French from Neutrality to Allied
                Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Americans and Dutch from Neutrality to Friendly
                Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Americans and Neutral_Allies from Neutrality to Friendly_Neutral
                Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Americans and Neutral_Axis from Neutrality to Unfriendly_Neutral

Combat Move - Japanese
            Trigger Japanese Unrestricted Movement: Setting movementRestrictionTerritories cleared  for rulesAttachment attached to Japanese
            2 infantry moved from Siam to Shan State
            1 infantry moved from Hunan to Yunnan
                  Japanese take Yunnan from Chinese
            1 infantry moved from Anhwe to Hopei
                  Japanese take Hopei from Chinese
            1 infantry moved from Anhwe to Kweichow
                  Japanese take Kweichow from Chinese
            1 infantry moved from Chahar to Suiyuyan
                  Japanese take Suiyuyan from Chinese
            2 fighters and 2 tactical_bombers moved from Kwangsi to Shan State
            1 artillery moved from Kwangsi to French Indo China
                  Japanese take French Indo China from French
            1 infantry moved from Caroline Islands to 33 Sea Zone
            1 artillery moved from Caroline Islands to 33 Sea Zone
            1 artillery, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 33 Sea Zone to 42 Sea Zone
            1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from 42 Sea Zone to Java
            1 destroyer moved from 33 Sea Zone to 54 Sea Zone
            2 fighters and 2 tactical_bombers moved from 33 Sea Zone to 54 Sea Zone
            1 battleship moved from 36 Sea Zone to 37 Sea Zone
            1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from 36 Sea Zone to Java
            1 battleship moved from 33 Sea Zone to 21 Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from Kwangsi to 36 Sea Zone
            1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 36 Sea Zone to 43 Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from 43 Sea Zone to Borneo
            1 infantry moved from Kiangsi to 20 Sea Zone
            1 artillery moved from Kiangsi to 20 Sea Zone
            1 artillery, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 20 Sea Zone to 37 Sea Zone
            1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from 37 Sea Zone to Malaya
            1 bomber moved from Kwangsi to Malaya
            2 infantry moved from Kiangsi to Kwangtung
            1 fighter moved from Kwangsi to Kwangtung
            1 fighter moved from Kwangsi to Kwangtung
            1 tactical_bomber moved from Kwangsi to Kwangtung
            1 submarine moved from 36 Sea Zone to 42 Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from Japan to 6 Sea Zone
            1 armour moved from Japan to 6 Sea Zone
            1 armour, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 6 Sea Zone to 35 Sea Zone
            1 armour and 1 infantry moved from 35 Sea Zone to Philippines
            1 infantry moved from Japan to 6 Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from Japan to 6 Sea Zone
            2 infantry and 1 transport moved from 6 Sea Zone to 21 Sea Zone
            2 infantry moved from 21 Sea Zone to Guam
            1 infantry moved from Japan to 6 Sea Zone
            1 artillery moved from Japan to 6 Sea Zone
            1 artillery, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 6 Sea Zone to 35 Sea Zone
            1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from 35 Sea Zone to Philippines
            1 marine moved from Japan to 6 Sea Zone
            1 cruiser and 1 marine moved from 6 Sea Zone to 21 Sea Zone
            1 marine moved from 21 Sea Zone to Guam
            1 cruiser moved from 36 Sea Zone to 35 Sea Zone
            1 destroyer moved from 36 Sea Zone to 37 Sea Zone
            1 fighter moved from Kwangsi to 37 Sea Zone
            1 tactical_bomber moved from Kwangsi to 37 Sea Zone
            1 bomber moved from Kwangsi to Philippines
            1 fighter moved from Kwangsi to Shan State

triplea_39828_Jap2.tsvg

[gamerman01]

Scramble from Queensland?
Scramble from Guam?

Thanks