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Combining A&A Europe with A&A Pacific

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flooglestreet
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Any one have any idea how to do this? Also, how do I get to thrasher’s page?
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bob van aelst
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Hi
The link to the wargamer seems to be dead.
Does anyone has a working link for the combination of Europe and Pacific?
Thanks
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[Global 1940] Research & Development

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• r & d global 1940 • • Pitt79

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@Pitt79 please elaborate the usa russia scenario thanx
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Create child forums here by A&A version

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• • • axis_roll

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I posted this in another forum, perhaps this might be a better place to generate some interest.

I believe it would be much more efficient to have sub forums here by A&A version.

It can be hard to wade thru all the house rules in this forum when I might be looking for something specific to A&A pacific or AA50….
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1941 & 1942 Intro. steps to use TPs, Subs, DDs and planes: simpler interactions

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• • • baron Münchhausen

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Thanks for your honest comment Ozymandiac,
is the opening post easier to read and understand now?
Same information, different order.
I tried as much as possible to be clear in this new edited version.
Even the second post of this thread is just a more formalized way inspired by OOB 1942.2 written rules, which say same things than first opening post but with all words of official rules.
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Under construction:Strategic Bombing Raid OOB & House ruled method and numbers

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• • • baron Münchhausen

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1942.2 SBR Black Elk hypothesis

Strategic Bomber
Attack 0
Damage 1D6, 1D6+2
Cost 5

Fighter
Attack 1
Defense 2
Cost 10

Break even point StB A0 C5, 1D6+2 damage vs Fg A1 D2: 21 StBs vs 30 Fgs: 0.700 StB/Fg
1StB D6+2 vs 1Fg D2: + 3.056 - 2.222= + 0.834 IPC damage/SBR12= +10.008
1StB D6+2 vs 2Fgs D2: +2.037 - 3.148 = -1.111 IPC damage/SBR9= -9.999 (Diff.: +0.009)
21 StB vs 30 Fgs: 0.700 StB/Fg
No FIT (Fighter Interception Threshold), always beneficial to Intercept.

Break even point StB A0 C5, 1D6 damage vs Fg A1 D2: 17 StBs vs 15 Fgs: 1.133 StBs/Fg
1 StB D6 vs 1Fg D2: + 1.944 - 2.222 = -0.278 IPC damage/SBR13 = -3.614
2 StBs D6 vs 1Fg D2: +4.861 - 3.056= +1.805 IPCs damage/SBR2= +3.610 (Diff.: -0.004)
17 StBs vs 15 Fgs: 1.133 StBs/Fgs
No FIT (Fighter Interception Threshold), always beneficial to Intercept.

Down below here is a different values doing SBR for 1942.2 and G40

Strategic Bomber in air-to-air combat SBR:
Attack 0
Bombard IC damage: D6 or 1D6+2

Fighter in air-to-air combat SBR:
Attack 1
Defend 2

IC’s AAA: @1 against each Strategic Bomber

1942.2 SBR HRules with StB A0 and Fg A1 D1 : damage 1D6 or 1D6+2

1 Strategic Bomber doing SBR against no interceptor

AAA roll = odds casualties

5/6 StB survived * 5.5 IPCs = +4.583 IPCs *3.5= +2.917
1/6 StB killed *5 IPCs = -0.833 IPCs

D6: +2.917-0.833= +2.084 IPCs
D6+2: + 4.583 - 0.833 = +3.750 IPCs damage/SBR

1 Strategic Bomber Att 0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor Def 2

Interceptor Fg roll/ AAA roll = odds casualties

2/66/6 = 12/36 1 StB killed by Fg
4/61/6 = 4/36 1 StB killed by AAA
4/6*5/6 = 20/36 No casualty at all.

Results:
Bombard on IC 20/36* ((1+2)+(6+2) IPCs)/2= +5.5 IPCs) = + 3.056 IPCs *3.5=+1.944
StB killed 16/36 *-5 IPCs = - 2.222 IPCs
1D6 vs 1D2: + 1.944 - 2.222 = -0.278
1D6+2 vs 1D2: + 3.056 - 2.222= + 0.834 IPC damage/SBR

D6 vs Fg D1: + 2.431 - 1.528 = +0.903
D6+2 vs Fg D1: + 3.819 - 1.528= + 2.291 IPC damage/SBR

1 Strategic Bomber Att 0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors Def 2

Interceptors Fgs roll/ AAA roll = odds casualties

20/366/6 = 120/216 1 StB killed by Fg
16/361/6 = 16/216 1 StB killed by AAA
16/36*5/6 = 80/216 No casualty at all.

Results:
Bombard on IC 80/216* ((1+2)+(6+2) IPCs)/2= +5.5 IPCs) = +2.037 IPCs *3.5= +1.296
StB killed 136/216 *- 5 IPCs = -3.148 IPCs
D6 vs D2: +1.296 - 3.148 =-1.852 IPCs
D6+2 vs D2: +2.037 - 3.148 = -1.111 IPC damage/SBR

D6 vs Fg D1: + 2.025 - 2.106 = -0.081 IPCs
D6+2 vs Fg D1 : + 3.183 - 2.106 = +1.077 IPC damage/SBR

1 Fighter Att 1 and 1 Strategic Bomber Att 0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors Def 2

Fighter roll/interceptors Fgs roll/ AAA roll = odds casualties

1/64/366/6 = 24/1296 1 Fg and 1 StB killed by Fgs vs 1 Fg
1/616/361/6= 16/1296 1 Fg killed by Fg and 1 StB killed by AAA vs 1 Fg
1/616/365/6= 80/1296 1 Fg killed by Fg vs 1 Fg
1/616/361/6 = 16/1296 1 StB killed by AAA vs 1 Fg
1/616/365/6 = 80/1296 No casualty vs 1 Fg

5/64/366/6 = 120/1296 1 Fg and 1 StB killed by Fg vs no casualty
5/616/361/6 = 80/1296 1 Fg killed by Fg and 1 StB killed by AAA vs no casualty
5/616/365/6= 400/1296 1 Fg killed by Fg vs no casualty
5/616/361/6 = 80/1296 1 StB killed by AAA vs no casualty
5/616/365/6 = 400/1296 no casualty at all

Results:
Bombard on IC: 960/1296 * ((1+2)+(6+2) IPCs)/2= +5.5 IPCs) = + 4.074 IPCs 3.5= +2.593
Killing 1 Fg: 216/1296 +10 IPCs = + 1.667 IPCs
Fg killed: 480/1296-10 IPCs = - 3.704 IPCs
StB killed: 96/1296 -5 IPCs = - 0.370 IPCs
StB & Fg killed: 240/1296* -15 IPCs = - 2.778 IPCs

D6 vs 2Fgs D2: +4.260 - 6.852 = -2.592 IPCs
D6+2 vs 2Fgs D2: + 5.741 - 6.852 = -1.111 IPCs damage/SBR

D6 vs D1: +4.503 - 1.690 = +2.813 IPCs
D6+2 vs D1: + 6.123 - 1.690 = + 4.433 IPCs damage/SBR

1 Fighter Att 1 and 1 Strategic Bomber Att 0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor Def 2
Fighter escort taking the casualty.
Fighter roll/interceptor Fg roll/ AAA roll = odds casualties

1/62/61/6= 2/216 1 Fg killed by Fg and 1 StB killed by AAA vs 1 Fg
1/62/65/6= 10/216 1 Fg killed by Fg vs 1 Fg
1/64/61/6 = 4/216 1 StB killed by AAA vs 1 Fg
1/64/65/6 = 20/216 No casualty vs 1 Fg

5/62/61/6 = 10/216 1 Fg killed by Fg and 1 StB killed by AAA vs no casualty
5/62/65/6 = 50/216 1 Fg killed by Fg vs no casualty
5/64/61/6 = 20/216 1 StB killed by AAA vs no casualty
5/64/65/6 = 100/216 no casualty at all

Results:
Bombard on IC: 180/216 * ((1+2)+(6+2) IPCs)/2= +5.5 IPCs) = + 4.583 IPCs 3.5= +2.917
Killing 1 Fg: 36/216 +10 IPCs = + 1.667 IPCs
Fg killed:60/216-10 IPCs = -2.778 IPCs
StB killed: 24/216 -5 IPCs = - 0.555 IPCs
StB & Fg killed: 12/216* -15 IPCs = -0.833 IPC

1Fg A1 1StB D6 vs 1 Fg D2: +4.583 - 4.166 = +0.418 IPCs
1Fg A1 1StB D6+2 vs 1 Fg D2: + 6.250 - 4.166 = + 2.084 IPCs damage/SBR

1Fg A1 1StB D6: +2.500 - 1.111 = +1.389 IPCs
1Fg A1 1StB D6+2: + 6.250 - 1.111 = + 5.139 IPCs damage/SBR

2 Strategic Bombers Att 0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors Def 2

Interceptor Fgs roll/ AAA roll = odds casualties

4/3636/36= 144/1296 2 StBs killed by Fgs
16/366/36 = 96/1296 1 StB killed by Fg and 1 StB killed by AAA
16/36*30/36= 480/1296 1 StB killed by Fg

16/361/36 = 16/1296 2 StBs killed by AAA
16/3610/36 = 160/1296 1 StB killed by AAA
16/36*25/36 = 400/1296 No casualty at all.

Results:
2x Bombard on IC 400/1296* ((2+4)+(12+4) IPCs)/2= +11 IPCs) = +3.395 IPCs 7=+2.160
1x Bombard on IC 640/1296 ((1+2)+(6+2) IPCs)/2= +5.5 IPCs) = + 2.716 IPCs 3.5=+1.728
2 StBs killed 256/1296 -10 IPCs = -1.975 IPCs
1 StB killed 640/1296* -5 IPCs = -2.469 IPCs
D6 vs 2 Fgs D2: +3.888 - 4.444 =-0.556 IPCs
D6+2 vs 2Fgs D2: +6.111 - 4.444 = +1.667 IPCs damage/SBR

D6 vs 2 Fgs D1: +4.863 - 3.056 = +1.807 IPCs
D6+2 vs 2Fgs D1: + 7.639 - 3.056 = + 4.583 IPCs damage/SBR

2 Strategic Bombers Att 0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor Def 2

Interceptor Fg roll/ AAA roll = odds casualties

2/66/36 = 12/216 1 StB killed by Fg and 1 StB killed by AAA
2/630/36= 60/216 1 StB killed by Fg
4/61/36 = 4/216 2 StBs killed by AAA
4/610/36 = 40/216 1 StB killed by AAA
4/6*25/36 = 100/216 No casualty at all.

Results:
2x Bombard on IC 100/216* ((2+4)+(12+4) IPCs)/2= +11 IPCs) = +5.093 IPCs 7=+3.241
1x Bombard on IC 100/216 ((1+2)+(6+2) IPCs)/2= +5.5 IPCs) = + 2.546 IPCs 3.5=+1.620
2 StBs killed 16/216 -10 IPCs = -0.741 IPC
1 StB killed 100/216* -5 IPCs = -2.315 IPCs

2 StBs D6 vs 1 Fg D2: +4.861 - 3.056= +1.805 IPCs
2 StBs D6+2 vs 1 Fg D2: +7.639 - 3.056 = +4.583 IPCs damage/SBR

2 StBs D6 vs 1 Fg D1: +5.347 - 2.361= +2.986 IPCs
2 StBs D6+2 vs 1 Fg D1: +8.403 - 2.361 = +6.042 IPCs damage/SBR

@Baron:

Summary:
StB A0 C12 vs Fg A1 C10
1 Strategic Bomber doing SBR against no interceptor
D6+2: + 4.583 - 2 = +2.583 IPCs damage/SBR run
D6: +2.917-2= 0.917 IPCs

1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor D1
D6+2: + 3.819 - 3.667 = + 0.152 IPC damage/SBR run
D6: + 2.431 - 3.667 = -1.236

1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors D1
D6+2: + 3.183 - 5.056 = - 1.873 IPCs damage/SBR run
D6: + 2.025 - 5.056 = -3.031 IPCs

1 Fighter A1 and 1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors D1
D6+2: + 6.123 - 5.334 = + 0.789 IPC damage/SBR run
D6: +4.503 - 5.334 = -0.831 IPCs

2 Strategic Bombers A0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors D1
D6+2: + 7.639 - 7.334 = + 0.305 IPC damage/SBR run
D6: +4.863 - 7.334= -2.471 IPCs

1 Fighter A1 and 1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor D1
D6+2: + 6.250 - 3.667 = + 2.583 IPCs damage/SBR run
D6: +2.500 - 3.667 = -1.167 IPCs

2 Strategic Bombers A0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor D1
D6+2: + 8.403 - 5.666 = + 2.737 IPCs damage/SBR
D6: + 5.347 -5.666= -0.319 IPCs

Comparison of this HR with Triple A SBR for 1942.2

1942.2 SBR HRules with StB A0 and Fg A1 D1 : damage 1D6+2 Triple A SBR for 1942.2: damage 1D6

1 Strategic Bomber doing SBR against no interceptor 1 StB doing SBR without interceptor
Sum: + 4.583 - 2 = +2.583 IPCs damage/SBR run Sum: +2.917 - 2 = +0.917 IPC damage/SBR run

1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor D1 1 StB A1 against 1 Fg D1
Sum: + 3.819 - 3.667 = + 0.152 IPC. damage/SBR run Sum: +3.69 - 3.667 = + 0.023 IPC damage/SBR run

1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors D1 1 StB A1 doing SBR against 2 intercepting Fgs D1
Sum: + 3.183 - 5.056 = - 1.873 IPC. damage/SBR run Sum: + 2.025 - 5.056 = - 3.031 IPCs damage/SBR run

1 Fighter A1 and 1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors D1 1 StB & 1 Fg A1 doing SBR against 2 intercepting Fgs D1
Sum: + 6.123 - 5.334 = + 0.789 IPC damage/SBR run Sum: +6.155 - 5.33 = + 0.825 IPC damage/SBR run

2 Strategic Bombers A0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors D1 2 StBs A1 doing SBR against 2 intercepting Fgs D1
Sum: + 7.639 - 7.334 = + 0.305 IPCs damage/SBR run Sum: +8.195 - 7.334 = + 0.861 IPC damage/SBR run

1 Fighter A1 and 1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor D1 1 StB & 1 Fg A1 doing SBR against 1 intercepting Fg D1
Sum: + 6.250 - 3.667 = + 2.583 IPC damage/SBR run Sum: + 5.973 - 3.667 = + 2.306 IPCs damage/SBR run

2 Strategic Bombers A0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor D1 2 StBs A1 doing SBR against 1 intercepting Fg D1
Sum: + 8.403 - 5.666 = + 2.737 IPCs damage/SBR run Sum: +8.403 - 5.666 = + 2.737 IPCs damage/StB
B

Simplifying units interactions of Transports, Submarines, Destroyers & planes

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• • • baron Münchhausen

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My mind evolved on this topic when I add my 2 cents into G40 Redesign thread.
Below are the main post which marks how things on lowering Sub A3 D1 C6 to A2fs D1 C5 and DD C6.
@Baron:

Thanks LHoffman for all the questions and commentaries. I would like to give answers to all but don’t have much time.
I will still adress at least a few for now.

@LHoffman:

Hide your kids, hide your wives, tanks are gonna destroy everything out there. :-D :-D :-D
See my related comment under Tac Bomber below…

@Baron:

SUBMARINES A2 First Strike D1 M2 Cost 6
Cannot hit or be hit by other submarines,

Any reason for no sub vs sub combat?

Yes. I don’t want that Submarine be considered as sea-fodder. Also, it needs a little boost on offense (to keep balance vs Destroyer) because it is the only unit which isn’t at lower cost. Now, Subs directly aim surface vessels only. That emphasized the screening and fodder function of Destroyers. If you invest a lot in Submarines, your own surface fleet will be vulnerable against your opponent’s Subs. That wasn’t the case OOB. Large fleet confrontation showed Submarine’s destruction festival. To bypass Subs in a gamey way OOB, you must forget to bring Destroyers, so aircrafts can directly hit enemy’s surface vessels while Submarines on defense (using first strike @1) can still be used as casualty to screen against attacking Submarines (even with first strike @2).
Hope I’m enough clear so you can see the issue.
In addition, I believe it is historically a rare event that a sub sink a sub. Almost the same kind of oddity as Submarine taking down a Fighter with their AA fire.

@Baron:

DESTROYER A2 D2 M2 Cost 6

Nice and cheap.
I read that Destroyers (and Destroyer Escort) were built in very large number amongst all navies.

@Baron:

TRANSPORT A0 D1 Last Strike M2 Cost 8, 1 hit

Must be escorted by a warship when making an amphibious assault in an enemy’s Submarines infested SZ or Transports infested SZ, so to be able to ignore them/ or fight them with combat units.
Otherwise, Submarines and Transports may be ignored during Transport Combat Move or Non Combat Move.

Why so expensive? Most everything else got a cost decrease but transports got increased.
It was a matter of balance compared to the defenseless transports taken last. Using such 1 hit Transport as desperate fodder in needy times can provides a few additionnal hits with larger and costlier warships. That wasn’t the case OOB. So at a matching cost with Fighter at 8 IPCs (OOB worth 10 IPCs), was about the way to statistically get a similar results compared to OOB defenseless transports escorted with Destroyers.

I add this post to provide a link to where my idea on Submarine and Destroyer evolved into.
@Baron:

Cost and units values is a complex matter.
If cost scale is mainly based upon a consistent OOB ratio amongst units, my previous scale can be increase near OOB too. (Something I just realized.)
Here is 2 comparative scales which can works with my units roster given above.

Unit type 1st scale Near OOB scale
Submarine 6 8 IPCs permanent A2 first strike against all surface vessels, including DDs
Destroyer 6 8 IPCs blocks Submerge and Stealth move on a 1:1 basis.
Transport 8 10 IPCS, 1 hit, Last Strike @1, no Taken Last casualty rule
Cruiser 9 12 IPCs with one time AAA capacity
Carrier 12 16 IPCs
Battleship 15 20 IPCs with one time AAA capacity

Fighter 8 10 IPCS
Tactical B. 10 12 IPCS A4D3 with +1 A/D combined arms to Tank
Strategic B. 10 12 IPCs
All aircrafts can hit Submarines without Destroyer presence.

Chosing the appropriate scale is an important issue.
I can only add on this matter that I believe that a lower scale than OOB would accelarate the Allies ticking time bomb because a lot depends on USA warships building pace.

Near OOB cost could be easier to get acceptance.
However, introducing direct hits between planes might produces a lot more losses amongst original set -up units. More money (from NOs or anything else ) could be needed to keep up with OOB rythm of losses.

@Baron:

@Black_Elk:

I’ll admit to being somewhat torn. On the one hand I think Baron’s unit interactions are excellent and very well thought out, and I also recall the development process over time in countless threads, so I’ve seen how its grown into a pretty complete overhaul. But I also know that people may be reluctant to adopt a series of sweeping changes to the roster. For those who want the familiar OOB combat system just with a different “campaign” dynamic (different NOs, incomes or starting unit distributions) a complete redux of the combat phase might put them off, since it requires you to learn a lot of new things.

I would say that threshold here for me is whether or not the unit interactions can be easily handled in tripleA, without requiring a bunch of new code, or the introduction of new phases and the like.

I’m not a huge fan of combined arms. I know in the OOB game this is a huge part of what makes TacBs useful, but I rather prefer it when each unit has a unique stand alone role, without being reliant on other units to be effective. Artillery set the precedent though, so I suppose its here to stay now, I’d just be careful not to run away with the concept. I think the combat phase becomes a lot less intuitive when the unit attack/defense values change based upon which other units are in the fight. The TacB is rather different than artillery, because it is itself boosted by other units, rather than providing the boost. Artillery has a baseline attack value of 2 that doesn’t change based on which other units are in the fight, which I think is a bit simpler to grasp. I suppose by now everyone is used to the combined arms that currently exist, but adding a bunch of new specialized unit relationships might be off putting to some. Again though, I’m willing to explore at this point. A ground up roster revision is very ambitious.

IDK which direction you will take but I dislike combined arms (except for Art and Inf or MI) too.
Changing the combat value of units during combat is annoying and slowing the pace on A&A boardgame. I know you are looking for simplicity. Hence few revised units, such as Subs, TPs, DDs.
I knew it was bit overstretched.

For Submarines and Destroyers, I cut down the Surprise Strike and blocker because most of the time there is enough DDs to neutralized this special ability. Making both at the same cost would have put a balanced Sub at A3 D1 vs DD at A2 D2. Keeping it at a lower but constant A2 first strike keeps the symbolic surprise attack (figurating the sneaky torpedoes) while putting Subs as a better offensive warship than Destroyer. On the other hand, I simplified the Sub defense value to a regular and constant D1. Anyway, most of the time, it was the usual Sub defense OOB since DD is always present to block Subs escape.

So, when Sub is part of a fight it keeps the same value from the start till the end. Simpler.
Since this Sub is weaker than OOB Sub vs Destroyers, I add Sub cannot hit Sub (for offense while making it a less interesting fodder) and gives it a better survivability with DD blocking Submerge and Stealth only on 1:1 ratio which make sense at the same cost.
At least, when a Submarine will be on offense, the A2 first strike promise to be more satisfying than OOB.

On TcB and StB, making them the same cost with same attack value A4 is going to put players on a difficult dilemma: better range and mobility or better overall unit in defense. Buying TcBs A4 D3 M4 instead of StBs A4 D1 M6 will reduced the effectiveness of Dark Sky which rely a lot on higher mobility.

@Baron:

@The:

Since Sub always have First Strike I thought only undetected subs have the first strike option (@2 in attack & @1 while defending) while detected subs fire along with all other vessels. At least this is the way we handle this in our games

OOB, you are right Sub cost 6, A2 D1 and gets Surprise Strike if no DD is present.

In my redesign Sub suggestion, DD cost 6 and block 1:1 Sub’s Submerge and Stealth Move, but can’t affect the Sub’s Surprise Strike (at 5 IPCs vs 6 IPCs, A2 first strike vs D2, the IPC ratio already put DD at the same OOB AACalc odds of 6 IPCs vs 8 IPCs, A2 vs D2)

OOB odds: 88% vs 11%
http://calc.axisandallies.org/?mustland=0&abortratio=0&saveunits=0&strafeunits=0&aInf=&aArt=&aArm=&aFig=&aBom=&aTra=&aSub=8&aDes=&aCru=&aCar=&aBat=&adBat=&dInf=&dArt=&dArm=&dFig=&dBom=&dTra=&dSub=&dDes=6&dCru=&dCar=&dBat=&ddBat=&ool_att=Bat-Inf-Art-AArt-Arm-Sub-SSub-Des-Fig-JFig-Cru-Bom-HBom-Car-dBat-Tra&ool_def=Bat-Inf-Art-AArt-Arm-Bom-HBom-Sub-SSub-Des-Car-Cru-Fig-JFig-dBat-Tra&battle=Run&rounds=&reps=10000&luck=pure&ruleset=AA1942&territory=&round=1&pbem=

Redesign odds: 88% vs 12%
http://calc.axisandallies.org/?mustland=0&abortratio=0&saveunits=0&strafeunits=0&aInf=&aArt=&aArm=&aFig=&aBom=&aTra=&aSub=6&aDes=&aCru=&aCar=&aBat=&adBat=&dInf=&dArt=&dArm=&dFig=&dBom=&dTra=&dSub=&dDes=&dCru=&dCar=5&dBat=&ddBat=&ool_att=Bat-Inf-Art-AArt-Arm-Sub-SSub-Des-Fig-JFig-Cru-Bom-HBom-Car-dBat-Tra&ool_def=Bat-Inf-Art-AArt-Arm-Bom-HBom-Sub-SSub-Des-Car-Cru-Fig-JFig-dBat-Tra&battle=Run&rounds=&reps=10000&luck=pure&ruleset=AA1942&territory=&round=1&pbem=

Simpler to let Sub, cost 5, attack A2 First strike all the time, but defend @1 regular.
Anyway, you would need Destroyer as fodder and to attack Sub, because they can Submerge, if their is no DD.

@Baron:

Unit type
Cost Combat values
Special abilities

SUBMARINE
5 IPCs A2fs* D1 M2
Permanent A2 first strike *against all surface vessels only, including DDs.
Cannot hit Sub or Aircraft
Submerge and Stealth Move

DESTROYER
6 IPCs A2 D2 M2
Block Sub’s Submerge (first round only) and Stealth move, both on a 1:1 basis.

TRANSPORT
8 IPCs A0 D0 M2, 1 hit,
Carry 2 units, 1 Inf + 1 any ground unit
No defense against warships,
1 Transport can escape from Naval Battle in the same SZ at each end of combat round, if there is no enemy’s aircraft. Simply remove TP from battle board and place it in the SZ on the map.
Regular AA @1 against up to 1 plane, whichever the lesser.

Undecided: Submarine’s Stealth Move and No Control of Sea Zone still afford 1 single shot @1 per Submarine unit against any warships or transports passing by in the same SZ.

This is one possible result once added into lower cost structure.
@Baron:

This is the reduced cost structure with near OOB cost for planes and Carrier holding 2 planes (Fgs or TcBs).
I also stick to this cost structure (5-6-9-12-15).
I put the 1 hit Transport at 8 IPCs.
I write here many ideas which still fit into core roster at this low cost.
All other ground units are as OOB, except for Tank which no longer gives attack bonus to TacB.

Feel free to quote, erase the quotation and my name, then change the units according to your idea.
This can be a tool to provide a full view of everyone roster.

Unit type
Cost Combat values
Special abilities

SUBMARINE
5 IPCs A2fs* D1 M2
Permanent A2 first strike *against all surface vessels only, including DDs.
Cannot hit Sub or Aircraft
Submerge and Stealth Move
On offense, Sub’s commander can allocate each hit whether on transports group or warships group, the owner still choose which individual unit is the casualty.

On defense, Stealth Move allows (but not compel to) each Sub 1 single roll@1 against any ships passing through the Sub’s SZ. Only each Destroyer can get a single retaliate roll @2.

DESTROYER
6 IPCs A2 D2 M2
Block Sub’s Submerge (first round only) and Stealth move, both on a 1:1 basis.

TRANSPORT
8 IPCs A0 regAA1 D0 M2, 1 hit, taken as casualty according to owner’s choice.
Carry 2 units, 1 Inf + 1 any ground unit
No defense against warships,
1 Transport can escape from Naval Battle in the same SZ at each end of combat round, if there is no enemy’s aircraft. Simply remove TP from battle board and place it in the SZ on the map.
Regular AA @1 against up to 1 plane, whichever the lesser.
Can unload in a Sub infested SZ if escorted by surface warships.

If you bring them in with attackers - as you would for amphibious - then any defense shots in excess of what is needed to sink the accompany ships MUST be applied to any transports until all shots are accounted for or there are no units left to assign them to. (Per OOB rule.)

CRUISER
9 IPCs A3 D3 M3
Shore Bombard 3
Gives +1 move to 1 surface vessel, paired 1:1

FLEET CARRIER
12 IPCs A0 D2 M2, 2 hits,
Carry 2 planes,
damaged Carrier still carry one aircraft.

BATTLESHIP
15 IPCs A4 D4 M2, 2 hits,
Shore Bombard 4

Both repair at purchase and repair phase in a SZ adjacent to a Naval Base SZ, or in NB SZ.
Naval Base cannot repair more than 3 warships hits per turn.

FIGHTER
10 IPCs A3 D4 M4
SBR: A2 D2, interceptors always destroy bombers first.

TACTICAL BOMBER
12 IPCs A4 D3 M4
TBR: A1first strike, Damage D6 on AB or NB,
SBR: can do escort mission for StBs without bombing AB or NB.

STRATEGIC BOMBER
12 IPCs A4 D1 M6
SBR: AA A1first strike up to two Fighters, whichever the lesser,
Damage on IC, AB, NB D6+2 /minimum damage 2 pts if hit by IC’s/AB or NB’s AA gun.
No damage when destroyed by intercepting Fighters.

All aircrafts can hit unsubmerged Submarines without Destroyer presence.

ANTI-AIRCRAFT ARTILLERY
4 IPCs A0 D1 AAx2* M1 CM or NCM, 1 hit,
Taken as last casualty on offence.
*Fire each round @1 first strike against up to two aircrafts, which ever the lesser.
Regular defense @1 if there is no enemy’s plane.
V

Make India count as a Europe VC

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• • • variance

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@oztea:

Because when the US buys the token for 5….
When it gets to soviet territory it can be cashed in for 10.

Thats to make it worthwhile for the allies to do.

Now I see better.

It is worthwhile for Allies to give IPCs to Russia, to get some troops in Europe it requires a long logistic line.
Simply giving (up to 12 IPCs) to Russia will allow a moving of 4 Inf from USA to Russia almost instantly.
When Russia and Archangel are part of a decisive ETO, it is in itself an incentive… unless playing with a greedy and selfish USA player.

That’s why it required some limits and the possibility to destroy some of this IPCs for Axis.
I

HBG Sea Mine, Research, Radar, SS Markers & Land Mine [Acrylic Markers]

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NM found it:

http://www.historicalboardgaming.com/HBG-Fuel-Markers-Acrylic-_p_804.html
A

Axis & Allies Global Design Flaws Part 3

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• • • aethervox

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The new map is an uneasy compromise, with some tts values reflecting oil wealth, others not.

Personally I prefer adding industrial base and mineral resources together to create a single economic index, but the separate oil values have been tried:

http://www.basesproduced.com/aaa.html

The big problem is that the Allies always have more than enough oil, the Axis hardly ever enough. Forcing the Axis to take oil centres to keep going makes their moves very predictable.

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