Yes I have seen it on our board many times 2-3 of our 5-6 players dont go with a sea lion move its all Barbarossa. I would say it is very effective at having a better than 50% chance of Axis victory
  Round one deal with the Royal Navy and set up Italy to follow up Germany with reinforcements
  Round two hit Russia hard with Germany and Italy  oh yea Japan has to help
  Keep some Navy to deal with any threats the Allies come up with and for convoy raids

idk…… you usually need those planes to fight russia, and like you said, britan wont be doing many landings anyway…

On your place I would ask the help for users of this forum.

Thank you Krieg. Iam getting some friends together to play our first global game. I have read the rules and alpha updates. The bombing was the last clarification I needed before we play . Thank again for the rules clarification.

No you have to let the western allies handle the navy stuff (in the Atlantic). As Russia I like to buy 1 air unit at least every other round (ftr/tac). In most games Germany does a SL fake (sometimes they go though w/it), and I like to be able threaten the German navy w/air when they come through the Baltic (makes them spend $ on carrier). When they are ready to hit Leningrad, I may just back out to counter attack (kill their ground units), and use the air to end the sea threat. I may not hit the navy, but they at least have to think about it. If I go ahead and nail the German navy in the Baltic, it comes w/guarantee that because I did the dirty deed for the western allies, they will replace my air power (at some point).  R1 I normally buy 1 plane some art/inf for the front (you have to have art to push/delay the Germans, inf alone are not to scary). You also need to be aware of what they can bring at any one tt at the front (seeing many one tt massive army pushes by Germany), and what you can do in a counter attack (if anything).

You also need inf stacks at front lines (mostly south) to keep Italy from being able to can-opener easily (make sure that the deeper Italy goes that they lose units along the way so when the axis gets closer, Italy isn’t involved. I also like to get my arm up, w/few mech. A Russian mobile force is necessary, especially if you also have Jap lurking in your back field, or you need to swing from north to south (or wherever).

By all means if your in trouble (maybe to aggressive), don’t worry about that silly 5 IPC NO connected to sz 125 (that you normally don’t get to often anyway). Get the allies involved, either through direct help on red tt’s (air for def etc…) or maybe through landings in Scandinavia, or other parts of Europe. If the Germans, Italians & Japs are all pushing into Russia, then you do what you have to. I’ve seen all six major powers fighting in Russia. Its a BS move, but whatever works. The western allies can be in Russia, and still be hassling the Euro coast, Med, Chinese coast, or DEI (if Jap is pushing hard to Russia (mech/tanks), they are not investing much to rebuild there navy/air-make them pay).

@suprise:

Page 18 of the Euro rule book and page 16 of the Pacific rule book
  My interp. of this is 1 sub, 1 carr with 2 planes. the sub gets a hit what happens …… the carr is tipped and the planes are in the air  if the sub does not fire a second shot then the planes need to land within their movement allowance. If you had 2 subs and they both hit then the carr would go down  I would say the planes would get away because subs cant hit air units
  Those two pages answer the Q’s for me

The movement allowance is only one when defending. The planes would need to land on an adjacent island, coastal tt, or friendly carrier w/room on board.

I will get a mod to change the name of the thread.

@AllyAxis:

@orania:

There is a major IC in Paris. This isnt possible with A2 rules. Captured Major IC turn into a small one.

Really.  I didn’t see that one in the rules I downloaded.   No Majors in non native territory can be built.  but France falls to a minor?  Didn’t see that one at all.

Holy crap your right.  I guess it only mattered for France since Britian did not fall  or russia. Not sure if we placed that many forces there anyway.  Because the Germans did not build that many forces there throughout the game.  The italians moved troops in,  well maybe before berlin fell late in the game the Axis player on turn 9 may have built more forces there,  but largely he used the Italians to defend western Europe and built germans in West germany to defend Denmark.

Ultimately I don’t think it impacted our game or its outcome,  but will note that for the future!!!

We haven’t tried this in global but my dad tried it in Europe. It worked really well against russia but the lack of pressure on Britain let them take all of Italy’s land in Africa. After that I build a minor in Egypt and started send tanks to Russia who had fallen back to Moscow and Stalingrad 3 turn after Britain sent tanks there was British armor in Moscow after that the German lost there hope of wining.

@knp7765:

SZ 109 is really good, especially if you can get it with SZ 119.  If Germany, or Italy, can get 4 subs in SZ 109 and 1 sub in SZ 119, you can nail England for 10 IPCs of convoy raiding even though the adjacent territories are only worth 8 IPCs (United Kingdom 6, Scotland 2) because SZ 109 borders both United Kingdom and Scotland.

lol
yeah right
if i only got 1 apple, you can’t take 2 away, so raiding 10 instead of 8 is BS hein ;)

What he is trying to say at least I believe is that the strategies will always focus around capturing VC. He prefers creative strategies where VC are unimportant and the idea is to knock out your opponent. The problem in his logic is that this is a historical game and historically there were certain cities that were essential to winning the war. Capturing Paris won the war against France, the German failure to take Stalingrad was a turning point in the Eastern campaign, so on and so forth. While I can understand his point the fact is that the victory cities are located in the strategic centers (for the most part) even if there were no VC in them those are still the territories you would want to attack and take over so it kind of makes the arguement null and void.

@valtteri771:

why would japan have to attack russia I have won many times as germany without sealion and japanese help in barbarossa.

Oh ,  and if you check out the early GNazi buys,  my Axis opponent  even admits he didn’t buy enough tanks since he used his airforce to destroy the British Navy in turn 2 and the Mediterranean Navy in turn 3  early in the game.  so the extra 9 IPCs from the far east could have been elminated earlier.  He didn’t hit it till Japan Turn 8  which meant the Soviets colleted 72 IPCs for the game from the far east.  cutting it down by turn 5 or 6 well after Germany was pressuring the Soviets and with Japan stomping to to india could have swung the war against the Allies!  I had also moved 15 far east troops all the way back to moscow and they were big help in retaking Stalingrad.

@Gargantua:

Never forget,

Subs can go through the straight of Gibraltar, weather you control it or not

I’ve sunk many an allied navy, at minimal loss, by popping a few Italian subs on the board, and blasting the allies for a round with sub/air attacks - through the straight.  Then following up with the GERMANS :P

But the door swings both ways…

100% agree w/you. I often buy both Italian, and German subs (S France, and/or Normandy) to set them back. You have to either kill their ground units so the are delayed, or destroy their fleet stranding their ground units to kill later. Once they get in the Med its a ruff road (or sea lane I guess).

I think there is still a consensus that the allies are in favor at the moment.  However I believe the current rules are so close that it is going to take a few back and forths of which power is ascendant before we settle on the true leader.  That being said, I think leaving many of the rules as is would be fine.  Perhaps a reworking of NO’s, but leaving them at the same value.  You appear to be saying that depriving US of that initial 30ipc’s in NO’s their first round of war might do the trick as well?  This is entirely possible, if going this route however I prefer the idea of making US pay to upgrade their IC’s.  This equals about the same amount and doesn’t mean the US is getting a ‘free’ upgrade.

Nice thread James!!! :-)

I’ve thought about an Allied Spain gambit for a while.  I believe if the Allies can somehow get Turkey and Spain it could work.  I definitely think that Spain can’t be taken early- I think its a late game tactic when the Germans press into Russia and leave France/Italy open- Spain maybe be a necessity to stop the VC win and gain an advantage.

I think a Spain gambit is tough, but someone is gonna figure a way to pull it off in certain situations.  Maybe you’ll be the one- keep thinking. :-)

Awesome!  Thank you.  :-)

@Tistel:

Only around 30 inf in Moscow? What are you players doing?

i’d say they’re playing, instead of stacking. good on them.

I am in the middle of game, round 4 America’s turn.  I took several pictures of the board that I could email you if you would like.  I could then give you the exact chip stacks around Russia since it is kind of hard to tell.  The situation is Germany has taken and hold Ukraine with about 15 inf, 2 art, 8 mech, 7 tanks. Russia has 17 inf in Bryansk with more in Russia.  The Luftwaf is all but gone, Italy is almost totally out of Africa and only has 1 trans and 1 DD on the board.  Japan has wiped out China and is poised to enter Russia, Russia inf are in Manchuria and there are 22 Brit inf in India with 2 art.  America has a small naval off Gibraltor and a large navy off the coast of Caroline islands (controlled by Japan) opposite the IJN in the Phillipeans SZ.

If you are interested shoot me an email, but I couldn’t get them to you until Sunday, since I am leaving town for the rest of the week.

Anniversary all nations.

In Global, I have problems remembering with Anzac and US ground forces, and J ground forces in Manchuria.

Revised, old Pacific and the old World i do not remember.

@gsh34:

James,

Good thought experiment you have going on.  Most of the time doesn’t Germany fully commit to Sealion on G3 by either doing a direct G3 attack on London or landing is Scotland, right?  If that is the case, they can see that on R1 and R2 the Russians have only purchased naval units (meaning a theoretical 26 ground unit deficit vs. max defend build) why do Sealion?  On Italy round 2, you could use the Italian air force to clear the blocking Russian BB in the Baltic Sea and then amphibious assault Leningrad.  Without those R1 and R2 ground builds, I would think Russia would be relatively easier to take down.  Especially when done in conjunction with Japan doing a max push into Russia which is what I think I would be doing with them if I saw the Russian build naval forces en mass.

Just my thoughts on what I would do if Russia made the builds you describe.

I tend to agree, it would be easier to take Russia first, would that be dangerous leaving UK alive, if USSR provides them a fleet to protect their builds. That seems like it gives both US and UK quicker and stronger strikes against Europe then would otherwise occur. I suspect even with no real land unit builds until turn 3, that Moscow could hold until turn 6 or 7, maybe longer maybe not.

That gives the allies a 3 turn window of opportunity to get entrenched in Europe and put some heat on Berlin/Rome. Key to this opportunity will be whether USSR can knock down the German factory on W. Germany turn 4…That severely limits what the Germans can build in Europe for defense. I could see USA knocking it down turn 5 if recaptured, and UK grabbing it turn 6…etc. Keeping Germany with only 10 unit builds turns 5-8.

Oh well, its just a crazy Russian navy idea. Not sure I will ever try it. You are basically screaming, take me! take me!. Certainly a magnanimous move to spare the British player and allow him to play sea lion free. I’d like to be that nice guy.