@gebs99:

Ive always played been Rusia, next time im planning on been Germany. i was thinking that it would be a better strategy agaisnt Rusia to go all out for the Cucasus.

IMHO if you have to advance evenly through Russian or else your forward units get cut off and encircled

Atlantic Sea Zones:

I’d say split SZ 11 and 12 into north and south with the south border being equal to the spit between SZ 19 and SZ 10.

Those two will stop 1 Round invasions of Algeria.

Splitting SZ 9 and 8 in half at the same level as the star for the Victory City at Toronto (so it will be split SOUTH of England) will stop 1 round reinforcements of England from SZ 10.

This will give German Submarines something to do in the Atlantic as well, since America cannot just jump across the ocean and dump their units into England/Africa.

italy is way cool. here is why:

2 tanks in bulgaria/ epl or 2 inf in EPL with ftr in range will nullify the effect of a 1inf  russian blitzblocker in EUK and BEL. that means whenever theese units are in range, russia cant  press germany with north/south push from KAR,BST / CAU,UKR .  this eases fighting for gerrmany alot imho, as it ristricts the red army.

of course italy will have to get their NOs as often as possible but how you do that really depends on what british / US are doing.

but i prefer italy pumping out ground units as much as possible. maybe a trn+ inf round one is best. this way you get 12 units at end of turn 3 to africa.

Early SBRs can slow the Axis war machine if America engages in them, but America also only has the two bombers on Round 1.  That’s 7 IPC usually.  Italy has 23 IPC after Round 1 and Germany has 45 IPC after Round 1.  I don’t see 7 IPC being a huge impact in comparison to the 68 IPC the Europeans have.  It’s barely more than 10%.

If America goes heavy bombers then they are also not going fleet (meaning Japan owns the Pacific and America only gets 1 NO, England none and Russia probably only 1 and Japan gets 3, Italy gets 2 and Germany gets 2.)  If America does not go fleet, then their SBR campaign is offset by the excess IPC the axis are pulling in that the Allies are not. (You need a lot of bombers to dry up the extra 25 IPC the axis will be pulling (possibly 30 IPC if Germany gets the 3rd NO as well) and make up for the cost of lost bombers AND on top of all that, do damage to the enemy.)

I just don’t see it being a winning move.

If a bomber does 1.5 IPC more damage than it costs to replace the bomber in the time it is expected the bomber to be shot down and the axis have 25 IPC in NOs MORE than the Allies (That is 35 IPC in NOs - Allies 10 IPC in NOs = 25 IPC in NOs in excess of the Allies) then it you would need 17 bombers to show a profit.  (16.67 to negate the extra income the Axis are getting and .23 to enter into positive territory.)

If you had 17 Bombers, doing 3.5 IPC each (assuming 3 are shot down by AA Guns before they can fire) you would have:

14 * 3.5 = 49 IPC in damage to the Axis.

Since this, invariably, means in Europe only, you are really limited to 32 IPC in maximum damage you can do.  (12 to Italy, 20 to Germany.)

To recap:

IF the allies do not go into the Pacific and focus on a bomber campaign you have the following:

Axis 7 to 8 NOs
Allies 2 NOs
Net Gain (Axis): +25 IPC

Maximal Damage to Axis Industry: 32 IPC (12 for Italy, 20 for Germany.)
Average Bomber Damage: 3.5 IPC
Average Damage to Bomber: 2 IPC
Net Benefit of Bombing Run: 1.5 IPC

To negate 25 IPC, the Allies need 25/1.5 = 16.67 Bombers
Most likely scenario of 17 Bombers attacking in SBR: 3 Bombers shot down to AA Fire
17 Bombers - 3 Bombers lost to AA Guns = 14 Bombers left
14 Bombers, doing an average of 3.5 IPC each = 49 IPC in combined damage

Maximum Damage Italy/Germany can take: 32 IPC.  Damage from Bombers: 49 IPC.  17 IPC in bomber damage wasted.

@Subotai:

HBs are teh most powerful tech in AA50, EOD!

My advise on tech is the same as advice on drugs, just don’t do it!

If you still want to play with tech, you can agree that you remove HBs from the tech chart, so if anyone gets HB they roll again.

As for Jen, I give you war bonds if I get HBs  :-P

I give you radar if I get HBs  :-P

Radar might be doable, but if you are saying that Heavy Bombers are it, they are automatic game over for the side that didn’t get them first, then you should give me my pick of technologies.

I assure you, I’ll absolutely murder whoever is my opponent if all they have are Heavy Bombers and I get Mechanized Infantry or Paratroopers for Germany - if I am facing an opponent of the same caliber as me that is.

Heavy Bombers are nice, I wouldn’t throw them away, but when I go for tech, that is not the one I am going for!  I’d MUCH rather have Paratroopers!

If I am Germany or America (in a KGF situation only) I’d much rather have Mechanized Infantry.  By the time you get those stupid bombers to pay off, Moscow will be garrisoned by dozens of tanks and some left over infantry.

War Bonds are just on par with Heavy Bombers because it’s effectively an ANTI-Heavy bomber (turning Heavy Bombers into normal Bombers again, and normal bombers take more damage then they give to the enemy.)

Imagine a round 3 situation:

Italy has its fleet in SZ 15, they maybe attacked Transjordan in round 2.
a clever move would be as UK - move your complete fleet to SZ 13, this fleet should be AC + 2 ftgrs, 2 Cruisers, 2 DDs and 1-2 subs. Yes, buy subs as UK if you want to kill that Italian fleet.

So that Italien fleet is trapped!
If they control Egypt and Trans Jordan, use your Inf from Persia and a Bomber to capture Transjordan, so the Italian fleet can’t escape via Suez canal.

So what can Italy do ?

Attack - that’s suicidal, especially with 2 UK subs and that Russian sub in SZ 13 (russian sub moved to SZ 13 first, UK followed)

leave - unfortunately they can’t ; SZ 16 is also 2 spaces away from SZ 13

block - the best option.

This is a 2 step move:
First take ground units from Italy and recapture Transjordan
Build a DD in SZ 14 hoping to block UK fleet and use Suez canal next round.

Next Round:

Now the Russian sub will have a use. :evil: Attack that newly build Italian DD with your sub and 1-2 fighters from Caucasus (you have to land all your Russian aircraft in Stalingrad or build new one there !!). SZ 14 is 2 spaces away from Caucasus, so that fighters can fly back in NCM safely.

It doesn’t matter if that sub survives, what matters is to destroy that DD - UK will move before  Italy and will destroy that fleet easily ! (use 2 subs and 1 DD plus aircraft, you will win with overwhelming odds - do not use your cruisers if not necessary, better attack France if possible but beware of German aircraft)

I like Darth Maximus’ idea of liberating one of the 2 4-IPC Islands, and then build a british IC there.
Sure, it would take 3 or 4 rounds before the US can safely hold it, but if they can, and UK can start building there, Japan is gonna be in trouble.

In those first 3 or 4 rounds UK should do everything it can to preserve IPC’s and it’s income, just threatening Germany to keep it honest (Russia should be able to withstand Germany for a while, especially if Japan is busy with the Yanks).

Not saying this can work, but it’s a complete different approach, which is worth thinking about.

@wodan46:

The central concept is that Britain loads units onto American transports one turn, then the following turn lands troops using both the American and British transports, then on the same turn land the American troops brought over by the transports in the first place.  This allows a huge One-Two punch against Western Europe.

This is works mainly if Axis doesn’t sink the UK Battleship/Transport and West US Destroyer/Transport, if they do, a different plan may be advisable.

Before Turn X: Britain focuses on getting an intact fleet with maybe 3 transports.  America builds 3 transports, and pulls its Pacific Fleet to the Atlantic.
Turn X: American Transports reach Britain and land a bunch of American troops there.  Britain builds a bunch of Ground Units.  America builds Bombers
Turn X+1: British Ground Units board American transports.  Britain builds Ground Units.  America builds Bombers.
Turn X+2: Britain invades Western Europe using both American and British Transports.  America then drops all their Infantry and Bombers into Western Europe.  Britain builds ground units.
Turn X+3: Take Germany, by first suiciding the British forces, then hitting it with the American forces.

X is ideally turn 2.  If you wait till Turn 3, you get the Pacific fleet as well.  Doing so lets you use 5 American Transports and 3 British Transports, meaning that you land 16 troops, then 10 troops, with air support.  For naval defense, you have something like 3 Carrier groups, 3 Destroyers, and a Battleship.  US goes to SZ18(Brazil), then SZ7(English Channel).

I think this is pretty interesting… it does put tremendous amounts of pressure on Germany very quickly.  The only thing I don’t like is that Italy will be able to dump max units per round into France at around the time that this is going to be ready to go, so I’m not totally sure that France will actually be able to be taken if Germany and Italy are doing their jobs with throwing units into the defense.  But anyway, the ship convoy can be redirected to other purposes if D-Day seems impractical (Algeria, Poland, or Scandinavia).  I’m going to try it the next time I play as the Allies and see how it goes, thanks for the idea. =)

Nah, axis-roll’s idea of 3 trans, 1 AC, 1 inf, 1 arm is better and what i’m  using now.

@chunksoul:

subs turn 1 for america to kill italian fleet turn 4

even building more fleet every turn it can’t survive

then bring american fleet underneath

Just wondering, how exactly do you get the fleet of subs close enough?  If I see 6 subs off EUS on A1, I’m going to take the Italian fleet back to SZ14 and build 2-3 DDs per turn.  You see, the problem is that you can’t get the subs close enough, because if they go to SZ12, I’m just going to move my fleet there and make them defend.  If you scatter, then I’m just going to block with 1 DD, or take out the front sub with DD+FIG.  There’s nothing you can do to get close enough to the Italian fleet, I can just stall the subs forever and keep building more DD.  If the point is just to lure me out to SZ12 so you can hit the fleet with a plane strike, well, ok, you’ll probably kill the fleet, but at the cost of a bunch of subs and planes.  I’ll take this trade at turn 4+, the fleet has done its job and now it’s all up to Japan.  I still think a surface fleet is the only real way to get the job done on the Italian navy in any sort of cost-efficient manner.

I’d probably go for a surge into china while holding the line against Germany.  Never seen this before though so I don’t know for sure, usually Russia just gets beat on while US/UK try to get something going.  My usual Russian strat is kill as many German and Japanese units as possible.

Front:

I think by the middle of a typical game, Russia should have 3 fighters going because they’ll need to trade three territories pretty routinely.

I am always amazed when I see people say they built an Industrial Complex in India and don’t follow up with saying worst idea ever.  Who are these Japanese players NOT taking the complex on round 2, again on round 3, again on round 4, etc until the Allies give up or are unable to liberate it again?

You have the firepower!  Round 2 you should have no less than 5 ground units and 5 fighters in range of India (compare to 4 or 5 ground units and an AA Gun and you can see how you have a significant advantage!).  Round 3, KNOWING that England HAS a complex there, and forcing Russia to send tanks to India instead of against Germany, you should definitely have half a dozen ground units and the cruiser/battleship for a follow up (plus any fighters you have remaining.)  From there it’s a matter of shuttling 4 to 6 ground units a round into FIC and then over to India to keep it from building units.

This shuttling should be a simple matter.  You only need enough units in SZ 37 and SZ 62 to prevent America from killing your transports (assuming you don’t just put ICs in Burma and FIC like I do) so you can bring troops down.  So what if America goes Pacific?  Russia’s throwing away tanks keeping you from building in India!  By the time America builds up, with Russia diverting 33-67% or more of it’s new builds to India, Germany should be just about into Moscow and looking to start a Sea Lion invasion fleet!

Yea, ok, I have a tendency to summarize the next 10-20 rounds, but I hope you guys can see where I am going.  Normally, Japan has to worry about an American flotilla in the Pacific for financial sake.  Normally Japan can’t even get into Moscow before round 5 and that’s assuming there’s nothing in the way!  But in this case, Russia’s sending so much down into India to keep it from building Japanese units that Germany is virtually unopposed.  (I’d also advocate, for the first time in my life, that Germany go for a tank dash if Russia’s sending so much down to India.  May as well!)

And I guess I need not say a word, just read the above post. Little do I post but it seems like I’m obliged.

destroyers are the infantry of sea
subs are the trench feet who annoy the infantry

@atarihuana:

ive seen many people hit sz56 yet often i refuse to do this and rather send 4 fighter to the BB for a clean kill. i dislike sending my only naval fodder unit to get killed round 1. also the british DD / TN off india gets kiled and the planes are in range.  the CA would  be at phillipines or at sz51 with the carriers.  so even if it is a tradeoff and i loose my BB, CA, DD  i still have 3 carriers + my naval builds while US has its remaining subs. not good.

since US has invested most to all of its money in the pacific its no big deal if it takes one more turn to take australia or india.

I had considered this as well.

I have even attempted it a couple of times.

I even thought of keeping the destroyer out and using only the fighters.

My conclusions:

The kill in SZ 53 is virtually assured.  It’s a matter of if you lose only the destroyer or also a fighter, if you send Destroyer, 2 Fighters in to attack the Battleship.

If you keep the destroyer, you risk a fighter, however, you have 9 fighters at the start of the game and 3 carriers, so you have some to spare.  Also, if you keep the destroyer, you can use it, in conjunction with at least 6 of your fighters, to attack SZ 56 if America puts submarines in the water.  This is a plus in my opinion because it means America either does not put only submarines in the water, puts them in SZ 10 instead, or builds surface ships which are more costly giving you an edge to get into position.

However, the added transport and Destroyer gives the American’s too much of an edge, IMHO.  Besides, when are you going to have a 33% chance to trade a fighter for a destroyer AND a transport (10 IPC for 15) and a 67% chance to lose nothing and get a destroyer and a transport in this game?

Yea, but with more and more English players going heavy through North Africa (to stop the Italian NOs and build up in Persia) you almost have to divert away from Chinghai anyway.  Why take it and leave your stacks open to Russian armor from Moscow when you can leave half a dozen units in Ningxia/Sikang (not half a dozen each, half a dozen total) and tie up half a dozen allied infantry while you build up in India?

Then again, I like the FIC/Burma/Indian complex.  Starting to call it the Burmese Road to Moscow. heh.

Have fun!!! :-D

Okay, tin.  I can buy turn four given the plan goes without hitch and the dice land in Germany’s favor in most of the battles.

Just glad you agree that turn 3 was a little exaggerated. :)

Anyway, turn 4 is pushing the envelope, it could theoretically happen, but realistically speaking, even with building as many tanks as possible with Germany (I say as possible since it’s safe to assume Germany is losing 10-20 IPC a round to SBRs thus reducing Germany’s available income to 30ish IPC) you might be able to break Russia’s back.

I am not saying Germany will lose.  I am saying it would be more realistic for Germany and Japan to plan a tank dash to Moscow with the goal of taking Moscow on Round 6.  This would account for some bad dice and the loss of income to Germany.

@Funcioneta:

There is no chance India can resist after J3 agains a decent axis player, even killing China J1. Any axis players should attack Egypt with 6 units

Doing so requires using the Bomber, which means that you will either have to let the Battleship/Transport pair live, or let the Cruiser/Destroyer pair live.  The first will allow them to launch an early D-Day and build a fleet quickly.  The second will allow them to probably wipe out the Italian Fleet nice and early.

@Funcioneta:

at least clearing it in most of cases, probably taking it with some tank, so all UK has to defend India is:

2 inf from trj 3 inf, art, aa gun form ind inf from bur 3 guys built round 2

My units available to defend India for J3 could be as many as 9 Infantry, 1 Artillery, 1 Fighter, 4 Bombers, and an AA, with a Battleship and a Carrier Group in the waters, plus the Burma Infantry and the Egypt Tank if they survived turn 1.  So total is more like 15 units, plus a nasty fleet off the coast that you need to use those Fighters on.  Oh, and keep in mind, anything sent to attack the India Sea Zone is going to be in range of the US air force and possibly navy.

@Funcioneta:

Japan starts with 5 trannies and it’s pretty probable they can send at least 4 loaded to India round 3 (8 units) plus a swarm of starting figs. Let’s say about 15-16 units and any bombardment shots they can join. India lost (and the IC if UK were so fool of building it). The only chance are soviet units, but they are too busy against western axis. I can wait another turn to more jap units arrive (units saved because you killed the chineses round 1) if I manage soviets send some european units to Japan instead Germany

If you wait another turn, I will have taken French Indochina, Manchuria, Kiangsu, Philipines, East Indies, Borneo, and the Caroline Islands.  Taking an IC in India, were it even possible, would no longer be of limited utility, given that you are being overrun.