I like the idea of Transports as units that are A0 D0 M2 C7 units that haul ground units from one shore to another. I also like the idea of groups of transports, that’s 2 or more transports, have a single collective defense roll of 1 on a d6. The transports would be taken as casualties last but so long as there’s 2 or more, they continue to take potshots @ 1 at their tormentors.

And here I thought I was being unique for having thought that up myself, before I read this thread. Parallel Evolution, I guess.

-Midnight_Reaper

@Erocco:

Am I blind or there is no victory deck to download? I understand everything is on YG’s website but I can’t find the VO deck filke.

It’s coming this week, check in around Thursday.

Russia Rev change

If the Armistice is NOT accepted, seems there should be some consequence for this decision…

propose this…

IF the Armistice IS NOT accepted, to represent the upheaval and disarray in the ranks and Russian command structure, on the first turn after no acceptance…

At start, except territory of Moscow, 1 infantry unit per territory is removed (down to min of 1). On this turn, Russia cannot make any attacks in territories outside of original Russia  - warships are still free to attack anywhere.

Not a problem.  Will do! 👍

very sorry everyone, we were experiencing technical difficulties today.

Here is a variant map.
Toying with Guadalcanal, Gilbert and Line SZs to make Solomons 2 SZs from Western USA SZ…

That way, both Hawaii and Carolines get a lot of Islands within 2SZs reach.

Carolines is like the core of a seven star from which you can use 7 branches and reach every PTO Islands, except Aleutians.
Hawaii can reach all south-eastern islands, New Zealand, Australia, New Guinea, Carolines, Marshalls and Wake.

DKs Hybrid PTO SZs_36_BM_revised_Midway_Johnston_Line SZ.png

The only way this could work would be if you limited the number of units that could be placed in a territory. If you didn’t then you would never be able to assault Moscow or any other capital or territory that had 50-60 units stacked on it. It would just be suicide to try.

A&A 1914 - Russian Civil War
At the end of the Mobilize New Units phase of any Russian turn starting in round 4, check to see if the conditions for the Bolshevik Revolution have been met. If the conditions are met, then the Bolshevik Revolution takes place immediately and Russia’s Collect Income phase is skipped. After the revolution is complete, Germany may begin their turn.

The Revolution Phase (Steps for setting up the Civil War):
1. All Russian and other Allied forces in Moscow, Karelia, and Kazakhstan are retreated by moving those units one space to any adjacent territory controlled or contested by Russia or a friendly power or onto any friendly transports in an adjacent sea zone. If some units cannot retreat in that manner, then they are removed from the game.
2. Retreat all Central Powers units and control markers from Moscow, Karelia, Tartarstan, and Kazakhstan in the same manner. If some units cannot retreat in that manner, then move them to their respective capitals.
3. Introduce the Soviet Power and assign a Central Powers player to take the responsibility of controlling this new power.
4. Place Soviet units on the board as follows: 3 infantry and 1 artillery in Moscow, 3 infantry and 1 artillery in Karelia, 2 infantry in Kazakhstan, and 1 cruiser in zone 12.
5. Place a Soviet control marker on Moscow, Karelia, and Kazakhstan. Place a Soviet control marker on the national production chart at 9 IPCs and then give 9 IPCs to the Soviets treasury.
6. Imperial Russia keeps any leftover IPCs in its treasury.

The Russian Civil War:
-It is a proxy conflict between the Red/Bolshevik (Soviet) forces supported by the Central Powers and the White/Nationalistic (Imperial) forces supported by the Allies.
-The Civil War begins immediately after the Revolution.
-The goal of Russia and the Allies is to take back Moscow and get Russia back in the war.
-The goal of the Soviets is to control of all of Russia and spread their influence if possible.

The Soviet Russian Republic is a new power. This new power follows the same turn phases as any other power and can purchase units and collect income from territories it controls and national objectives it completes. Soviet Russia’s capital is Moscow. Soviet Russia’s turn occurs at the end of the round after the USA and before Austria-Hungary. Soviet Russia is at war with all the Allied powers. For simplicity, the Soviet units use the red Central Powers chips and Soviet Russia is treated as a member of the Central Powers but with certain limitations regarding the movement of its units.

Per treaty of Brest-Litovsk, the territories that make up “Outer Russia” (Livonia, Poland, Belarus, Ukraine, Finland, and Sevastopol) are ceded to the Central Powers. Soviet Russia must also recognize and respect the sovereignty of Persia and Afghanistan and Soviet land units cannot enter any these territories. The Central Powers also recognize Soviet Russia’s claim over the territories that make up “Inner Russia” (Karelia, Moscow, Tatarstan, and Kazakhstan) and cannot enter these territories. Soviet units can never enter a territory that was originally, or is currently controlled or contested by the Central Powers.
Soviet sea units can move through sea zones with Central Power but are not allowed to end their movement in any sea zone with Central Powers units. Soviet sea units are hostile to Allied units and are subject to the effects of sea mines of any Allied power.

Contested territories: If the Central Powers and Russia contest any territories in Outer Russia when the revolution occurs, the Imperial White forces there remain in combat with the Central Powers. They are allowed to retreat to any adjacent territory still controlled or contested by Imperial Russia on their turn of course per normal combat rules.

Since Moscow becomes the new Soviet capital and was never captured by any power through a combat, it does not count as a victory city for the Central Powers. When Imperial Russia takes back Moscow, this does not count as a victory city for the Allies.

The Revolution only happens once per game. If the Imperials have taken back Moscow, and are losing the war at the end of their turn and the conditions for Revolution are met, then no Revolution would occur.

While Soviets have Moscow, the Allies can capture and collect IPCs for Russian territories that they control, including Romania and Serbia. Once Moscow is back in Imperial hands, then all original Russian territories controlled by the Allies are reverted back to Imperial Russian control, including Romania and Serbia.

In the event of an Imperial victory, the Soviet Power is still in play and any remaining Soviet forces will remain on the board and participate. Imperials will collect any unspent IPCs left in the Soviet bank.

The Soviets do not need to control Moscow for a Central Powers victory in the game.

Design Note:
These rules do not simulate the Russian Republic of 1917, or any of the minor factions such as the independence movements, the Green armies, and the Black Army.

It is more realistic to move warships from one SZ to another.
But, would you retreat more than 1 TT to repair your Tank?
(Land movement are much slower and falling back damaged Tanks while staying in position with Art and Inf make such delay an issue. You also have to compare between planes for the cost. Aircraft mobility and versatility is way more interesting than 2 hits units which have to return to IC for repair.)

IMO, it is easier to consider that such unit are repaired right on place with spare parts.

A different procedure I suggested a while ago is that you can only repair one and have to pick a damaged Tank as casualty before allocating a hit to damage another Tank.

So, instead of 10 Tanks staying on battle until the 11th hits.
A second hits eliminates a first Tank.
This becomes far less effective, but it is easier to follow a single damaged Tank per stack.

However, I did not search on how to calculate such way of allocating damage.

@Nowhere:

@Variable:

So have we come up with a solution to the purchasing problem? Or do I just bin it all and teach my 9 year old 42.2 or 50? I’d love to make this version work as it would be great for a pub battle. I’m tempted to do the +1 to every territory.

IMHO, 1941 is more a learning tool to introduce people to the game than a staple of the series. Once someone has the basics down, you’d be better-off moving-on to either 1942.2 or the new Anniversary Edition, then you don’t have to worry about “fixing” the money issue in 1941.

Well, I agree with your assessment of the games and will do so with my son. But we don’t always have time for the larger games so I was looking for a way to get more purchasing power into a small quick game. I like the simplicity of this one over, say, Revised. It takes a lot of the “level 2” rules out which is great for him. But I want him to explore more complex buys.

Looks Like Japan placed a Hospital in Manchuria….

Suggested Rules from Historicalboardgaming.com, 3D unit from CombatMiniatures.org

Purchase: 4 IPP
Placement: During place units phase in
any land zone in a supply path.
Effect: In any adjacent zone, if there is a
land battle, roll a D6 for each such zone.
On a “6” place one of the eliminated infantry
in the field hospital
hospital 1.jpg
hospital 3.jpg

@Der:

Yeah I guess I should have stuck with the more generic term “troopship” - although the Lusitania was a liner that went down. All ships were vulnerable at certain places and times.

Lusitania, a civilian ship, was sunk in 1915.
Struck by one torpedo, it exploded and sunk because there was ammunitions on board.
Also, it was slow because half engines were temporarily not operational due to a coal shortage.

Not a good case for fast, military, troopship.

SS Athenia was sunk in 1939.
It was the  beginning of WW2.
It was not equipped then and speed was only 15 knots.
But still, a U-boat U-30 was able to sink her.

Belarus & Ukraine Border: The border between these territories, is known as the Polesian Lowland.  It is the drainage basin for several rivers in central Russia.  In the spring, this area becomes an absolute swamp with the winter melt and runoff, and with a limited road network and thick woods, it was next to impossible to move any heavy ordinance through this area.  To represent this impact, on each Spring turn (defined as an EVEN numbered turn), artillery and armored unit movement across the border is prohibited.

Right. The ordinance they dropped was substantial by the standards of those days, but the effect was to reduce the morale of the populations: effect was to reduce IPC by effecting the will of the people to continue the fight.

So allow them SBR capability.

Additionally, they were good fighters in the air and air units could not even reach them till latter in the war if they conducted high altitude attacks. Basically their biplanes were very slow at climbing and had a limited ceiling.

Looks like Japan built a Labor Camp in Korea

camp 1.jpg

Hi Erocco,
these numbers are based on a formula found during Classic time by Dauvio Vann and his friends, then improved and adjusted to better fit the need of Second Edition units. Here is one link in House Rule:
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=40346.msg1684954#msg1684954

Below, you get the whole formula and a short explanation:

@Baron:

@Dauvio:

It came to my attention that one of my formulas are already out there that I discovered 30 years ago.
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=185969 has also discovered the formula P^2*N=S
And just for fun you can try these formulas also. S/P^2=N. √(S/N)=P
P=POINTS
N=NUMBER OF UNITS
S=STRENGTH OF ONE KIND OF UNITS IN A TERRITORY
This formula should replace the punch formula. It is much better then the punch formula.

Now the next formula is (P100)/(C^26)=S
P=POINTS
C=COST
S=STRENGTH OF THE UNIT BASED ON COST
With this formula you can also price units according to their strength. √((P100)/(S6))=C
This formula is for points. (S*(C^2*6))/100=P

For better results for some of these formulas, have all your units cost ten times then what they are. These are some of the VANN FORMULAS I came up 30 years ago.

If you have any questions about these formulas, please ask.

I found how you can get the main part of Vann formula or Baron-Larrymarx according to a specific unit as benchmark.

I took the Fighter A3 D4 C10 and I wanted to convert into Tank A3 D3 C6 as benchmark (Baron-Larrymarx formula).

Then I saw what I did.

Power (of attacking Fighter): A3 * C6 (cost of Tank)/C10 (cost of Fg) * 1 Hit Point C6 (cost of Tank)/C10 (cost of Fg) = 1.08
You can reduce this equation because (cost of Tank)(cost of Tank)/ (cost of Fg)*(cost of Fg) is same to
(cost of Tank) IPCs^2 / (cost of Fg) IPCs^2 and give a simple ratio.

C6^2*A3/C10^2 = 1.08
36 squared IPCs 3 Power * 1 Hit /100 squared IPCs = 1.08 PowerHit Point

This explained what is hidden in Baron-Larrymarx formula:
Offence or defence strength factor= 36*Power/Cost^2.

The whole Enigma formula is
Refence unit Cost^2Power of the actual unit1 HP/Cost of the actual unit^2

So, the Basic offence or defence strength factor result (1.08, in this case) is express in Power*Hit Point
1^2*Power (of a given unit)*1 hit/Cost (of this same given unit)^2

And this formula can be adapt according to any benchmark, for instance a 1 IPC unit:
131 hit/10^2 = 0.300

And this is a very small number. That’s why Vann formula:
Strength= (Power100)/(Cost^26)

add an arbitrary 1001/6= 16.667…
So, 16.667131 hit/10^2 = 0.5
And this would provide the Fighter strength attack factor based on an hypothetical benchmark unit of √16.667 = 4.0825 IPCs.
A 5 IPCs revised Tank in Vann formula gives a Strength : 16.66731 hit/5^2 = 2.00 powerhit

Can you elaborate on the ship calculations?

Destroyer strength: .30144/8^2  = 0.675
Cruiser    strength: .60144/12^2= 0.600
Battleship strength: .701442.618/20^2 = 0.660

These numbers means that Destroyer is the most optimized unit for combat to buy for each IPC invested, then it is battleship and finally Cruiser.
Said otherwise, Cruiser is sub-optimal for the cost.
3 DDs C8 A3 D3 (A9 D9, 3 hits) will be stronger than 2 Cruisers C12 A6 D6 (A12 D12, 2 hits) if you can use a Battlecalc to test D10-sided values.

From stronger to weaker for 120 IPCs basis:
15 DDs A3 D3 (A45 D45)
6 BBs A7 D7 (A42 D42)
10 CAs A6 D6 (A60 D60)

I’m sure…bump! :mrgreen:

@TheAandAClassicDude:

Germany: The Waffen SS: Costs 4 IPCs. Attacks and Defends on 2 or less. Moves 1 (Use Germany�s Infantry pieces from Axis and Allies Classic to represent them.)

Could we leave out the Nazi unit? The last thing I want are people falsely thinking this is game and website is some kind of alt right meeting place.

Besides, Germany doesn’t need any HRs help when they can churn out 5 IPC tanks.

@Baron:

Maybe I did not fully understand what this meant and I just catch the “Let me convince you” part. I’m not that fluent in speaking english.

Oh, I see. I was complimenting Ichabod on convincing me that defending with artillery is easier than attacking with artillery.

@Baron:

Nonetheless, the best part I was hoping for is about Russia’s demise according to YG’s Infantry and Artillery values. I believed you wanted to correct this with your units values. I tried to convinced YG that Russia need a strong Artillery, so by my comment I was curious about how you analyze Soviet situations and why your units improve the balance for Russia instead of worsening it. My comments was not focus on unit values but more about what Russia needs to make an interesting game against Italy and Germany.

Russia’s a tricky subject in my games because I introduce new minor powers that change the game balance in the Baltic (Sweden and Poland) and on the Black Sea coast (Greece).

In general, I tend to balance by adding more infantry rather than by adjusting unit values.

Adding cavalry also made a big difference because it provides Russia with a cheap unit able to take good advantage of its interior lines of communication during Barbarossa. The Armored Car might also help Russia get more out of each artillery piece.

I personally think there should be equal tech for the same unit that gives different units in the same class.

Example infantry tech but each tech is different for each nations.

USSR would be conscripts.
Germany would be SS.
UK would be Homeland infantry.
France would be Resistance.
Italy would be Frogmen.
Japan would be “Koreans”
US would be Marines
ANZAC would be conscripts
China would be suicide bombers.

And then work around that. Or what you could do is set the tech upgrades to actual units each nation has that Axis and Allies don’t have set up. Like China being able to buy tanks as an example.